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Functional programming has fascinated me! But not enough to ever write a single line of code. Every time I come across one of those sites saying FP is going to solve all the problems that exist in programming I read it with curiosity. But I've never seen a single site that delves into the guts of what it would take to do a significant program, such as a word processor. Everything I've read indicates (between the lines) that when tackling such a problem FP would actually get in the way of accomplishing the goal. With their newer tree structure use it may be possible, but it still seems like a complete pain, and a memory-intensive hog. If anyone ever comes across a 'create a word processor with FP' site let me know!
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Yeah. I actually tried it to see what it would be like... the answer is that it's effectively a thought experiment - nothing much more than that. With something like F#, you can also pretty much break the rules and start writing C# with different syntax, and in effect, that's what you end up doing: the functional thing ends up becoming nothing much more than a more cumbersome way to declare fairly standard methods. I don't think it could ever be used to write actual systems - such as your word processor, and every time I've tried to get someone who evangelizes this stuff to explain how it would be done, they just get angry. So I win!
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Thanks for sharing your experience. For a while I was confused, because I heard that full systems were made in lisp, which my reading made me think was functional. A few months ago I actually dug deeper into that and found that lisp isn't an 'only-functional' language, and my 'A-Ha!' light turned on! So I'm still waiting for someone to show me my word processor example!
If I'm not mistaken, another disadvantage of doing one fully functional is there is no way to really organize and see the code as you can with OO. Functions everywhere! But maybe I don't understand it enough. It just seems like a pain in the ass.
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I had no idea C actually has (or had, haven't updated since ANSI C) a goto statement in it.
(not that it's in anyway sane to use)
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I agree. For many years I assumed that C, C++ and C# had no GOTO - then I saw it in some example code somewhere and was shocked!
I still didn't use it myself - I've never had the need for it - I was just surprised it existed.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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C# too?
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Yes, apparently.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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Not strictly programming, but regarding HTTPS protocol. For a long while I was convinced that sending sensitive data in the query string of an HTTPS request was insecure, because I believed the URL (including the querystring) was un-encrypted. At the time I was working with a financial services company with many third parties sending data around in pseudo-webservices. I refused to deal with 3rd parties that insisted on passing data in the querystring, and insisted on POSTing it instead. It took a while (many months) before I realised that when using HTTPS protocols, the client and host negotiate first and the actual URL (with querystring) is only sent once keys are exchanged and can therefore be encrypted over the wire. It just seems counter-intuitive that a string I can type into the browser address bar, or into Fiddler, or set as a string for a WebRequest address, would actually get encrypted before sending.
Nobody ever actually called me out over it though, and a few companies changed their interfaces as a result.  
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Over ons - wie zit er achter brood.net? - Brood.net[^]
A site that promotes the eating of European bread to Europeans; as someone living in the Netherlands, I eat Dutch bread, not Portuguese. Not gonna eat more bread due to a campaign either.
No contact options; but superior translation options, and even added features for the visually/audible impaired. Would envy a lot of sites.
Paid for by European subsidies. To promote European bread to a population that already eats local bread.
Shames us.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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I also eat local bread: Naan, Pitta, Ciabatta, Focaccia, Soda bread, Baguette, ... all made locally ... 
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Your tax Euros at work. 
The biggest lie ever: "Hello, I'm from the Government, and I'm here to help you."
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
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Daniel Pfeffer wrote: The biggest lie ever: "Hello, I'm from the Government, and I'm here to help you."
"Hello, I'm from the Government, and I'm here to force those people over there to help you."
They sometimes help, just never personally. But they always speak as if it's their own doing.
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... and he's been drinking McVomits coffee*.
Which he describes as
Quote: Tasting like caffeine lost a knife fight to the colour brown.
I'm definitely taking his word for it. 
* Don't ask. It's a long story.
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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It's brown, hot, and contains caffeine. What's not to like?
Software Zen: delete this;
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And it's far better than the mystery liquid that came out of coffee machines at work 20 or 30 years ago. I wasn't a coffee drinker but started to drink it because it was free and I was clueless.
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It amazes me I survived college with an intact gastrointestinal tract. More than once I spent a 40-hour day in labs, living off of vending machine coffee and cigarettes(*). The coffee came in a 4 or 6 ounce cup, and typically left brown, gritty powder in the bottom. You learned to swirl the cup a bit when you finished the last of it so that you got all of that caffeine goodness in you. The notion that coffee could taste good was not a consideration.
(*) I quit smoking January 1, 1991. Becoming a smoker was the 2nd dumbest thing I've ever done in my life, and quitting was the smartest.
Software Zen: delete this;
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OriginalGriff wrote: ... and he's been drinking McVomits coffee*.
You don't go to MacDonalds for the cuisine. You go there because it is easy. Not the kind of coffee that you surprise guests with, so exact the same quality as their food and completely in line with expectations.
On a cold and rainy day, I prefer to wait with their muck than without it. At a Starbucks I don't have the patience to explain what a plain coffee is. Don't bother asking if they drink that crap in their own canteen; both MacDonalds and Starbucks hire youngsters who drink soda's and have no idea how coffee is supposed to taste (outside of bitter).
OriginalGriff wrote: * Don't ask. It's a long story.
Let me make it a short one; MacDonalds as a restaurant is rather successful and profitable. I have never seen our local one without customers, ever. It is not to my liking, but also not going to M$ it by calling it a McVomit. That's the long story; like a hobbyist PC enthusiast blaming Microsoft.
If he was serious about his coffee he'd be taking a thermos-can with him. And yes, on occasion, I do. Inside the jacket, one liter.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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FYI, the link in your .sig goes to a site that Malwarebytes blocks because of a trojan.
Then again, the link is to a tool that purports to convert C# to VB, so maybe it's intentional. 
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Greg Utas wrote: FYI, the link in your .sig goes to a site that Malwarebytes blocks because of a trojan.
Thanks for the info, will remove it then.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote: At a Starbucks I don't have the patience to explain what a plain coffee is
I went there once, asked for my coffee black, I got the 'deer in headlights look', it was an awkward 30 seconds before I explained what it was. Quite frankly I'd just as soon go to McVomit... 
"the debugger doesn't tell me anything because this code compiles just fine" - random QA comment
"Facebook is where you tell lies to your friends. Twitter is where you tell the truth to strangers." - chriselst
"I don't drink any more... then again, I don't drink any less." - Mike Mullikins uncle
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Haven't been there for a long time, but it was always a buttpain to be behind some special idiot who was ordering a special coffee, with special instructions, that took forever to make.
Edit: In Canada, Tim Horton's is a popular donut/coffee chain. Some people order triple-triples and two-by-fours, meaning triple cream and triple sugar or double of one and quadruple of the other. No wonder there are so many people waddling around.
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jeron1 wrote: I went there once
I been there three times; got thrown out of the place once.
So, I take my coffee with me. Not possible at the airport, so rum then as an alternative.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote: MacDonalds as a restaurant is rather successful and profitable.
Have you seen how much they charge franchisees to operate one of their stores? It's no wonder McDonalds Corp makes a ton of money.
"One man's wage rise is another man's price increase." - Harold Wilson
"Fireproof doesn't mean the fire will never come. It means when the fire comes that you will be able to withstand it." - Michael Simmons
"You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him." - James D. Miles
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David Crow wrote: Have you seen how much they charge franchisees to operate one of their stores?
I don't care? It is obviously worth it, otherwise people would not invest into it. Franchises are never free. Those that can't survive paying it, close. Simple as that.
--edit
Capitalism. The American ideal. MacD's is viewed here as everything that the US represents.
David Crow wrote: It's no wonder McDonalds Corp makes a ton of money.
No wonder at all; the consumer votes with their money.
And regardless of what country I'm in, it always tastes the same. It's a reliable fatty tasteless burger.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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McDs is not a restaurant, its a sales job.
I'm not sure how many cookies it makes to be happy, but so far it's not 27.
JaxCoder.com
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