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lopati: loaming wrote: Windows 11 maybe, experience with older to the current version show otherwise.
Not in my experience. My Windows 10 computer seems to download and install updates precisely when I'm not using it.
lopati: loaming wrote: Anyway nothing should wake a sleeping computer
If we use the term "sleeping" rather loosely, then yes. You do realize that the computer is technically not fully "asleep", right? otherwise it wouldn't be able to instantly wake up when you open the lid or touch the power button.
The computer's power LED ought to be blinking intermittently when it's sleeping (if you normally just close the lid), which should be an indication that it's not entirely out of action.
While I see your point, I do not quiet share the same opinion that the computer waking up to perform updates is such an exasperating ordeal.
When I want my computer to do absolutely nothing, I shut it down or hibernate it.
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Rajesh R Subramanian wrote: While I see your point, I do not quiet share the same opinion that the computer waking up to perform updates is such an exasperating ordeal.
It wouldn't have been an ordeal at all if the lid had been open and the computer hadn't become extremely hot. I just now played my game for a while and it isn't as hot as it was when I opened the lid after it's rude awakening.
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I understand that an overheating laptop could become a potential fire hazard or such. This is not desirable at all, and I concur with you.
This thread though, is now heading from being about the annoyances of an operating system to cheap laptop hardware that overheats even when the lid is open (which may have nothing to do with the OS). 
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Rajesh R Subramanian wrote: If you don't like security updates (wanna cry?),
If MS used the updates as they should, people would not deactivate them
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Nelek wrote: If MS used the updates as they should, people would not deactivate them
And how exactly would that be?
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Trying to avoid possibles missunderstandings... I am not telling people deactivating them are doing good, I am telling that it doesn't surprise me that some people are deactivating them.
Sometimes, updates will annoy you
I've had Windows Update make me lose unsaved work. I've had it sitting there pending while waiting to rush out the door. I've had it install drivers that caused all manner of problems. I've had it change features so that they work differently and left me confused. I've had it consume bandwidth, eat up storage capacity and do any number of unexplainable things to my machines.
Those of us who've felt Windows Update-inflicted pain will all agree on this:
Microsoft needs to make Windows Update better.
But I do agree with the rest of that post. Deactivating them is a risk and has consequences.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
modified 27-May-17 15:10pm.
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I'm sorry, but that link... It sounds like WAY TOO MUCH exaggeration to me. It also demonstrates a profound lack of understanding of how updates work, and possibly why it's needed.
I could go on to make a lengthy post, but here's an example:
Nelek wrote: I've had Windows Update make me lose unsaved work.
This is incredibly stupid because it's not as if updates sneak out from behind and will catch the user unaware. I'm pretty sure it sat there asking to be restarted like six dozen times, and the user clicked "after 4 hours" or something like that repeatedly. And when that 4 hours finally came, it restarted, only to be blamed.
Reminds me of the quote "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits".
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If you have had read the link... even the link itself says it.
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Sorry, guilty as charged.  
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If a laptop runs hot to the point where it could damage itself just because its lid is closed, that's a serious hardware design flaw. Don't blame software running on it for that.
I've left plenty of laptops running with their lids closed performing jobs that leave CPU usage at 100% for hours at a time, such as overnight video conversion--that should never be a problem.
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Rick York wrote: I do NOT trust windows 10 and I will never allow this machine to sleep again. From now on it will be full power offs for this machine
Microsoft had Windows 10 turn my laptop on from a full power off in order to install one of their updates. Don't ask me how they did that -- must have scheduled some power-on event into its hardware behind my back or something. I might have accepted that, except they left it on when they were done -- they didn't even have the decency to turn it back off.
Within a week I'd put 8.1 back on it, and it'll never see a later version of Windows -- my (non-replaceable) laptop battery is more valuable than their updates.
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
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I feel your pain. Some of the stuff they have done with this OS is absolutely ridiculous.
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I'm still not a huge fan of Windows 10, despite running it on most of my "everyday machines"...but going back to 8.1 seems like a step backwards.
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Well, I wasn't going to go all the way to windows 7 -- that is a step backwards. The OS is a tool, nothing more, and 8.1 gets the job done without the Windows 10 big-brother-you'll-install-my-updates-when-I-tell-you-to crap.
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
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I thought the claim was that MS had backported all the telemetry stuff to 7 and 8.x?
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Drat! You're right!
Oh well, at least I'm missing out on An Offer You Can't Refuse (web comic)[^]  . For now...
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
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I'm wondering if anyone here has experience with a data recovery service for hopefully extracting data from a failed hard drive. The drive is a 1 TB spinner that is probably around 30% used and failed a few days ago. By failed, I mean all it will do is click for several seconds (I'm assuming it's the heads hitting the stops) after power-on...then nothing.
The drive was the main data drive in my home/office server and has stuff that I can probably live without, but would rather not if it can be retrieved affordably.
Thanks for any input!
"Go forth into the source" - Neal Morse
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Have you tried the disk's manufacturer / distributor? They may have suggestions. Best of luck!
Get me coffee and no one gets hurt!
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I did this a few years ago & they were able to restore whatever I needed - the drive electronics had failed.
My understanding is they replaced them and copied the data off.
It was expensive - literally paid for each file
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My company had to pay $2,500 to recover data from one of the manager's failed drive.
Not to worry though, being a proper, technically cautious, CP'er, you had a recent backup... didn't you? 
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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I have backups of the most important stuff. There were however many, many folders on the drive that weren't included in the backups. I admit to becoming lackadaisical with backups regarding making sure everything was included. One important thing that has come up missing was a sql database used by the business...the last found backup is 10 months old. I thought it was safe as it's data file (mdf) was on the OS drive, however, it's log file (and backups) were on the drive that failed. I've been able to get the most important stuff back so far...that I know of now. Lesson learned. 
"Go forth into the source" - Neal Morse
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I have had (limited) success in getting data off a failed drive by first putting it in the freezer for a few minutes.
OTOH, If you are going to pay someone to do the job, I would probably not try that first.
OTOH, she wore a glove.
Arguing with a woman is like reading the Software License Agreement. In the end, you ignore everything and click "I agree".
Anonymous
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theoldfool wrote: putting it in the freezer for a few minutes
That was one of my initial thoughts, but then I read warning against it. I've handed it off to my business partner. We're sending it in to a lab to see what the expense will be. It's been a long week so far recovering, but finally everything seems to be working.
"Go forth into the source" - Neal Morse
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This always works for me:
1. Buy a new identical model drive.
2. Take the circuit board off the new drive and replace the bricked circuit board with it.
3. Read all your data.
4. Put the good circuit board back onto the new drive, and voila!
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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That only works if the electronics failed. It won't do anything about WTF caused the hardware in kmoorevs drive to get misaligned so that the read heads are hitting the platters.
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, waging all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies.
-- Sarah Hoyt
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