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brucerchapman wrote: But if you're not cut out for it, it's can be a wretched job. It's the sort of job that if you hum along at the lower 30% in terms of ability, you'll get 90% of the crap jobs. You'll get stuck supporting products written in technology two evolutions ago, like some weird VB3 app that is still mission critical and runs on a Windows 95 machine. You'll have to try and sort through 10 years of messed up spaghetti code - somewhat like having to live with the village bike, it's dreary and embarassing.
How right you are, Some colleagues of mine at the University end up doing help desk support and other tail end jobs because they hated programming, they are still struggling to keep up with technology and enjoying meagre salaries for all their efforts.
Albert Dadze
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If the fear of loosing jobs or creating competitior is making us not to ask our relatives to join software development?
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Absolutely not. At least in Spain, I'm only trying to save them from an underpaid and overworked job that's actually paid and seen by spanish society as kindly as a mcdonald's (or similar) job.
Not that I mean it's a bad thing to work for a hamburger mini-factory, it's just that I don't think it's worth getting a degree in CS to get paid the minimum wage and beeing laughed at.
"I disagree with your every single word, but I'll defend to death your right to say them." - Voltaire
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asthalas wrote: I don't think it's worth getting a degree in CS to get paid the minimum wage and beeing laughed at.
I love Spain and would love to work there, but the wages software developers get paid is pitiful. Have you considered that since you are in the EU that you could work in the UK for more money? (HINT: We are desperate for good software developers in Glasgow)
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I have thought of it, but I have a familiy now and that keeps me from moving!
I did travel a lot until I settled in Valencia. It was fun and I strongly recommend it.
Now I have to remind me that I have little money but great weather
Tnx anyway!
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asthalas wrote: I did travel a lot until I settled in Valencia. It was fun and I strongly recommend it.
Now I have to remind me that I have little money but great weather
Valencia is a great place. I've only had a chance to visit once. I went camping just to the south of the city. I most enjoyed my visit to the LLadró factory. They have some beautiful stuff in there, although I couldn't believe they were allowed to smoke while painting the figurines.
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how desperate is desperate? Because if you think the wages in Spain are bad, I'll wager they're astronomical compared to the Middle East. I am looking for a change too
There are 10 kinds of people in this world. Those who understand binary and those who don't...
______________________
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook
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Not all of the Middle East.
In a nation where technology is respected, appreciated, and pursued, the pay is good. Major top-end software development goes on: in Israel.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
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I'm in Portugal, I though about it a while ago, and I'm still thinking about it.
Although same problems like wife and a kid had me grounded 'till now.
I'm thinking about spending a year or so just to see if it really worths it...
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AlexCode wrote: I'm in Portugal, I though about it a while ago, and I'm still thinking about it.
Although same problems like wife and a kid had me grounded 'till now.
Our schools often have additional classes for non-English speakers to get up to speed and your kid will be speaking like a native in no time.
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And as we're speaking about this, how much is "well payed" there?
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AlexCode wrote: And as we're speaking about this, how much is "well payed" there?
As in Glasgow?
Well £30K ($60K) seems to be about average for a software developer. A bit more if you are in a financial company.
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As Colin say, it depends on where you are and in which sector.
£45k is not uncommon for a senior developer working in the engineering sector in the South East UK, but a financial sector position in London could well go for £70k or so (it would have corresponding higher pressure, of course!).
It really depends on what you're looking for. A quick search of http://www.jobserve.co.uk[^] should give you an idea of what's around.
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To leave my life here it must be for more that £45k a year.
I think my base line is on £60k...
Maybe I'll try that in a short time.
Thanks!
Alex
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asthalas wrote: underpaid and overworked job
not the same case in india, compared to others soft people are gaining good and there are some exceptions and yes its a kinda overworked job.
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For what I've read, it all comes down to:
How well/bad are programmers paid in your country compared to the average salary?
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