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Use to... Tim Smith17-Dec-01 2:05 Tim Smith 17-Dec-01 2:05  I use to, then I grew up. Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc. Re: Use to... CodeGuy17-Dec-01 7:08 CodeGuy 17-Dec-01 7:08  I used to do it a little bit in my younger days as well, but I knew it was wrong and stopped it. My main issue with software now is that I have many dev tools that I own that reside both on my laptop and my desktop. I see no reason to buy two licenses. I can't use both machines at the same time, so why should I buy copies for both? So as a result, this Product Activation nonsense that is getting popular with Microsoft and Borland really gets on my nerves. It seems bent on irritating the regular user rather than actually targeting true pirates. CodeGuy The WTL newsgroup: over 1070 members! Be a part of it. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wtl Re: Use to... Michael Dunn17-Dec-01 7:52 Michael Dunn 17-Dec-01 7:52  CodeGuy wrote: It seems bent on irritating the regular user rather than actually targeting true pirates. That is, in fact, exactly their intent. --Mike-- My really out-of-date homepage "Not our fault we are intellectually superior to the rest of the office." -- Paul Watson in the Lounge, 12/12/2001 Sonork - 100.10414 AcidHelm Big fan of Alyson Hannigan. Re: Use to... Tim Hodgson18-Dec-01 5:14 Tim Hodgson 18-Dec-01 5:14  As a software developer with my own software business, I have a hard time with this issue. On the one hand, I cannot afford to buy seperate copies of software to have on my laptop and on my desktop. On the other hand, when companies buy my software and only purchase one license, then turn around and ask for support on multiple machines, it really makes me angry. Some of these companies are in the Fortune 500! Where do we draw the line? The prices for my software have increased significantly to combat the problem of users buying one copy and installing it on multiple computers in multiple locations. I imagine that this is why certain products like MSDN and Visual Studio are priced so high. Re: Use to... Carlos Antollini18-Dec-01 5:31 Carlos Antollini 18-Dec-01 5:31  In my country the soft is Very expensible, I buy the MSDN Profesional Edition, plus Visual Studio and Sql Server.... for example I can't buy the office because Sometimes I must to sacrify all that I earn for buy software.... I disagree with the price of MSDN Enterprise Edition. M$ Know that but make nothing.... Best Regards.... Carlos Antollini. Sonork ID 100.10529 cantollini Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Paul Watson16-Dec-01 22:13 Paul Watson 16-Dec-01 22:13  If it is company related then we naturally always try before we buy. Then if we like the app we buy it even before the trial is over. However if it is for personal use and the app is in dollars or pounds then more often than not I simply cannot afford it. $25 may seem like not much to the developer of the app but here in SA that is R300. A fair wack of money (I could take my girlfriend out to the fanciest restaurant in town and only be able to spend that). I do try though to keep everything company related, so that I can get the apps regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa Do you Sonork? I do! 100.9903 Stormfront "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" 17-Dec-01 1:28 17-Dec-01 1:28  Actualy you are absolutly right, but what about learning process??? Im c/c++ programmer and i was not able to pay 2000$ for VC++ just to learn it some times ago. Ok im already professional and most of time im not working for f... money, becoase im trying to help people to solve there problems even i have no money in my pocked, to be onest i used pirates VC++ to learn it a long time ago, becoase im simple cannot afforted any course's and even buy VC++. I thing that some one in M$ and also other company's should realy thing about it, and do not thing only about: "How get more more more money". Actualy there is a long story and i not gonna continue... I hope you'll agree with me. Regards Oddmaar. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Tim Smith17-Dec-01 2:05 Tim Smith 17-Dec-01 2:05  Not even in the least. I can't afford it isn't an excuse for stealing software. I want to learn sailing but I think boats are too expensive. STEAL ONE!!! Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" 17-Dec-01 2:30 17-Dec-01 2:30  I want to learn sailing but I think boats are too expensive. STEAL ONE!!! The difference is, you have a real chance of getting caught and being punished for stealing a boat. How many people get caught for stealing software or office supplies for home use? It's not just about right or wrong either. Believe it or not, the rules and laws are there to protect the interests of some people, typically those more civilized (or silver-lized). In third world countries, even truely honest people are stealing software and not feeling guilty about it. I once worked in a small company (in USA), they have more than 5 developers but only one legal copy of every software they use. These are just my observations, not trying to encourage any software theft. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" peterchen17-Dec-01 3:08 peterchen 17-Dec-01 3:08  Tim Smith wrote: I can't afford it isn't an excuse for stealing software. Easy to say for those who can afford. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Michael P Butler17-Dec-01 3:15 Michael P Butler 17-Dec-01 3:15  Theft is theft. What makes a software package any different from anything else. I don't think the bible says Thy shall not steal (apart from computer software) Michael Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" 17-Dec-01 3:25 17-Dec-01 3:25  Heard from some where: "If you steal a piece of jewlry, you will get killed. If you steal the whole country, you will be the king." Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" peterchen17-Dec-01 4:34 peterchen 17-Dec-01 4:34  I agree with software not being different from a book here. Or your neighbours wife, if you want to quote the bible . However, what's called theft today is called patriotic tomorrow. and vice versa. If people wouldn't break laws from time to time, we'd still have jus primae noctis. And my point still holds true: "Theft is theft" is easy to say for (and usually said by) those who can afford. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" simik17-Dec-01 4:31 simik 17-Dec-01 4:31  > I want to learn sailing but I think boats are too expensive. STEAL ONE!!! You shouldn't mix stealing of physical things and stealing of software. The last one is not stealing at all -- it's illegal copying in fact... But it's still a crime, you're right. The only loss for a software company from software stealing is not getting money for it... But if I can't afford it I won't pay for it anyway Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Joe USer17-Dec-01 6:53 Joe USer 17-Dec-01 6:53  I always thought of piracy as a sudden un-negotiated change to your EULA. Seriously tho, as a kid I used to trade games with friends, I grew up. I can afford the software now, and if It's too expensive, I go with another company. Also, there are trials of most important programs. If you're using it once, then use the 90 day demo or something. If you use it every day, then It's a good investment. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" 17-Dec-01 9:28 17-Dec-01 9:28  > But if I can't afford it I won't pay for it anyway No, but you will most probably find an alternative and use, for example, a cheaper program. Because I, begin a student, can't afford Photoshop, I use PhotoImpact, which is much cheaper. If I had just warezed Photoshop, the cheaper alternatives hadn't gotten any money from me. I think that makes a difference. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Michael P Butler17-Dec-01 2:31 Michael P Butler 17-Dec-01 2:31  Do you make money off the software you create with your illegal copy. If so, then I can't agree with you. Michael p.s Your use of M$ indicates that you aren't a professional. Script Kiddies use M$, professionals have more sense. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Paul A. Howes17-Dec-01 4:04 Paul A. Howes 17-Dec-01 4:04  Michael P Butler wrote: p.s Your use of M$ indicates that you aren't a professional. Script Kiddies use M$, professionals have more sense. Here, at my office, where everyone is a "professional" in every definition of the word, we call Microsoft funny names, like "Micro Shaft", "Micro Slop", "Mickie Soft", and more. Poking fun at a company does not make us any less professional. You need to get off of your soapbox and take a look at reality. -- Paul "I drank... WHAT?" Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Navin17-Dec-01 5:19 Navin 17-Dec-01 5:19  Michael P Butler wrote: p.s Your use of M$ indicates that you aren't a professional. Script Kiddies use M$, professionals have more sense. I think your message could have two distinctly opposite meanings. Did you mean: your use of Microsoft software indicates you aren't a professional? Or did you mean your use of the term "M$"? I think either way could be a valid statement... The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese. Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" David Wulff17-Dec-01 11:58 David Wulff 17-Dec-01 11:58  LOL! I thought that after reading it to, but you beat me to it. ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg Re: Bit of "try before we buy" and "too expensive" Todd Smith17-Dec-01 17:39 Todd Smith 17-Dec-01 17:39  You just called yourself 1337 Todd Smith

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