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Re: None NormDroid26-Aug-04 1:16 NormDroid 26-Aug-04 1:16  James R. Twine wrote: I started making a six figure salary when I was ~27 Thats some going, contracting or permanent? Re: None James R. Twine26-Aug-04 5:11 James R. Twine 26-Aug-04 5:11  norm.net wrote: Thats some going, contracting or permanent?    Thanks!  That was permanent (salaried) -- I did not do any contracting work until after the so-called "bust" of the .com bubble.  But I should have mentioned that various factors dictate my rate: travel, commuting/driving time, ability to telecommute, etc.  I do not always go in demanding six figures.    For example, for one gig I was able to work entirely out of my home office (plus a 45 minute drive once a month for meetings), and could take an hour or so a week to visit my kids at daycare.  Result?  A reduced rate in the high $80K to low $90K range; I am more than willing to knock off up to $20K (or even more for the right position!) to be able to work out of my home office rather than waste time driving to work (and my employer gets more hours of work as a result, even whan salaried).    Now, consider them wanting me to drive an hour (or more!) to work, no telecommuting, perhaps even out-of-state income taxes?  Talking an easy 6 figures to get me in for an interview, minimum.  But at least I make that clear to them before the interview, so that we do not waste each other's time (much).    Peace! -=- James Tip for SUV winter driving survival: "Professional Driver on Closed Course" does not mean "your Dumb Ass on a Public Road"! Articles -- Products: Delete FXP Files & Check Favorites Re: None NormDroid26-Aug-04 22:57 NormDroid 26-Aug-04 22:57  James, I admire your brashness. I suppose the saying goes "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys" comes into swing. Anyway good luck. Re: None James R. Twine27-Aug-04 2:54 James R. Twine 27-Aug-04 2:54  norm.net wrote: James, I admire your brashness. I suppose the saying goes "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys" comes into swing.    Thanks!    One developer/consultant that I have a large amount of respect for (we all call him "Darth") once said: "you are paid what you are worth" (or maybe it was "you are worth what you are paid").  IIRC, his point was that if you end up doing work for someone at a reduced rate, you become worth that rate.  So be careful working for peanuts!    Peace! -=- James Tip for SUV winter driving survival: "Professional Driver on Closed Course" does not mean "your Dumb Ass on a Public Road"! Articles -- Products: Delete FXP Files & Check Favorites Re: None NormDroid27-Aug-04 3:08 NormDroid 27-Aug-04 3:08  James R. Twine wrote: So be careful working for peanuts! ...and becareful working with VB Cheers Norm Re: None James R. Twine27-Aug-04 13:58 James R. Twine 27-Aug-04 13:58     Hear, hear!    Peace! -=- James Tip for SUV winter driving survival: "Professional Driver on Closed Course" does not mean "your Dumb Ass on a Public Road"! Articles -- Products: Delete FXP Files & Check Favorites Re: None Molybedenum25-Aug-04 6:03 Molybedenum 25-Aug-04 6:03  Any certification is no replacement for a degree. MCP/MCSE/MCAD/MWHATEVEH... they learn how to glue peices together, and how to interact with the environment. Instead of that, I learned how to break the system, see how it works, and put it back together in a better way. Well, not exactly, but it's close. The best way to go is to have a job while in college. Go local, find a shop that you can get some part time work in, and make sure that it isn't the school itself. Screw certifications, unless some dopey company is willing to pay you to get one. I also disagree with your definition of wisdom, and where you get it from. There are many unwise people that have had many experiences. Take bungy jumpers / sky divers as an example. Yes, personal experience is one of the ingredients of wisdom, but so is observation of other's experiences. Wisdom comes as a result of those things mixed with something within, insight. 10 PRINT "I know BASIC!" 20 GOTO 10 Re: None James R. Twine25-Aug-04 15:13 James R. Twine 25-Aug-04 15:13  Molybedenum wrote: Any certification is no replacement for a degree.    Some would say that a degree is no replacement for experience. Molybedenum wrote: The best way to go is to have a job while in college.    Did that. I worked for both of my colleges as a programmer and assistant SysAdmin, in fact.  Not to mention working as a developer during the summer.  Having those jobs while in school is what convinced me that I was wasting my time.  Some of the staff there agreed with me, and that was enough for me to leave. Molybedenum wrote: I also disagree with your definition of wisdom, and where you get it from. There are many unwise people that have had many experiences.    Absolutely right; that is Exactly why I said:       Experience is what you get applying that knowledge in <big>different</big>(!!!) scenarios   Those scenarios include fail scenarios as well as successful ones, and watching the steps other take and the results as they succeed or fail as well (following by example).  Granted, I was not completely clear on that point. Molybedenum wrote: Wisdom comes as a result of those things mixed with something within, insight.    Insight mixed with a little hindsight, and maybe a smidgen or foresight, perhaps? Regardless, an interesting point you make there.    Peace! -=- James Tip for SUV winter driving survival: "Professional Driver on Closed Course" does not mean "your Dumb Ass on a Public Road"! Articles -- Products: Delete FXP Files & Check Favorites

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