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jkirkerx wrote: The way I see it, if your selling $18M of construction jobs a year, $250K+ is a small price to pay to confirm your not losing money.
As always, depends. If they would have seen it as you did, then yes! If they still trust the old guys, then... no! 
jkirkerx wrote: Was the ops decision based on code and best practices, or was it a decision based on best business practice
After a long discussion the ONLY (like the only one and no other, especially technical - don't know why he mentioned embedded... I guess to build some sort of aura over it) argument OP came up with was financials with a little bit of narcisism (I am the only one that delivers on time/on budget, I know better the project etc.; ofc, there are other points of discussions since he said he coded from the beginning which raises other questions but will ignore those), thinking that whatever he build now will be scraped in the future (because phase 1 was scrapped) and redone correctly when the real money comes in. At a high level, it makes sense if you are sure of that outcome though why would someone pay you once to write some bad code (that works nevertheless) and then pay you again to write the good code? I can understand that phase 1 might have changed so much... but also phase 2? 
Eusebiu
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Eusebiu Marcu wrote: (I am the only one that delivers on time/on budget, I know better the project etc.;
I hear that from my car mechanic friend that works at a Porsche dealership. And my construction contractor friends as well. It is a pretty important track record to keep, as a contractor being considered for hire.
I pay myself first, 2 hours a day 7 days a week, to learn some new skills. First being economics, 2nd - How money really works, 3rd - how to invest and manage my investments and assets, and now Rich Dad Poor Dad, 2 chapters left, learning the difference between assets and expenses, how the rich stay rich.
Overall in the end, the op is on his journey of learning and mastering his skills, trying to get to the next level which usually leads to higher pay or salary, and a higher quality of life, and I can appreciate that. But one day he will have to figure out the money part, like take a step back on this skill and open the door to another skill that he can use personally to enhance his wealth. After reading Rich Dad Poor Dad, my new training says to offer respect to the op, and perhaps just offer better guidance if he's willing to learn.
If it ain't broke don't fix it
Discover my world at jkirkerx.com
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jkirkerx wrote: I hear that from my car mechanic friend that works at a Porsche dealership. And my construction contractor friends as well. It is a pretty important track record to keep, as a contractor being considered for hire.
LIke I mentioned to OP also - I wonder what the team would say; if you are contractor, you really don't say that (especially, if that team is clients team).
jkirkerx wrote: my new training says to offer respect to the op, and perhaps just offer better guidance if he's willing to learn.
No one was disrespectful to him - the repliers were really trying to understand the motives but OP could not provide real ones (except cost). Like many said, things do not add up - no one will be sure that the code will be scraped and pay you money to develop it (why would it develop it in the first place?! :crickets: ). Most likely he wanted to post something that would create a stir and increase his visibility and not a real problem he encountered (even for the Lounge).
Eusebiu
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Touche ...
That was well evaluated, for I didn't have time to read all the post and follow it as close as you did. But I like your points. The shear number of responses shows that it was a thought provoking post that questioned are own personal values or morality.
If it ain't broke don't fix it
Discover my world at jkirkerx.com
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It's not "spaghetti code", it's "Flow Diagram code". An easy 1:1 direct conversion.
As long as the customer continues to use a Flow (aka State) Diagram as the documentation, then it's Knex spaghetti for the win!
Naming the `goto` junction points is hard, but then naming is hard anyway. Customer is likely to adopt your naming anyway if they haven't already named things (states)  .
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I'm inclined to agree with this.
That said, I still feel spaghetti applies in as much as the code jumps around, and sometimes fires off one thing, which causes another thing, which makes the final result. It's hard to follow without a diagram.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
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It's a 'source of truth' problem. A well labelled complete flow diagram pre-defines the structure.
Meanwhile a rambling weasel word requirements document is, well, rarely complete, even conceptually. So,
for A very comprehensive and precise spec | CommitStrip[^] ...
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While I have written, or tried to write, well-structured code for over 45 years, there was a time when I had no choice. I was dealing with making changes to the mainframe operating system, a beast in which the non-resident portions were in pages of 384 memory words in length. This was in the days when a 64K machine was considered fairly large.
Not only was it spaghetti code, one of the standard tricks was to overwrite the memory used by the housekeeping and initialization code in order to use it as storage. After all, if that code was only ever executed once, then after it ran it was simply occupying space for no good reason. This, of course, was all done in assembler, and predated the use of read-only memory, so writing self-modifying code was not only de rigueur, it was a talent you had to learn and be good at. Little of that code ever got well commented, but that was the way we rocked.
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We called that overlay programming. You planned your design to allow for the orderly reuse of memory. One could have a program that used 5x the memory you had available. It wasn't like virtual memory where the hardware made all of that transparent, but it accomplished the same basic job except you were in control of when and what overlays were called into memory. The main or parent program was always in memory.
"A little time, a little trouble, your better day"
Badfinger
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I am guessing you were stuck in C?
I would have expected you to go with one of your generated state machines if you could use C++.
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No, but generated code wouldn't have really helped me here. This flow is too irregular.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
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Wordle 697 4/6
⬛⬛🟩🟩⬛
⬛⬛🟩🟩⬛
⬛🟩🟩🟩⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
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Wordle 697 3/6
⬛🟩🟩⬛⬛
🟩🟩🟩⬛🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
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Wordle 697 4/6
🟨⬜⬜⬜⬜
⬜🟨⬜⬜🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
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Wordle 697 4/6
⬜⬜⬜⬜⬜
⬜⬜⬜🟨⬜
🟨⬜⬜🟨⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
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Wordle 697 3/6*
🟨⬜⬜⬜⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
#2 was a lucky guess!
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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⬜⬜🟩🟩⬜
⬜⬜🟩🟩⬜
⬜⬜🟩🟩⬜
⬜🟩🟩🟩🟩
⬜🟩🟩🟩🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity. - Hunter S Thompson - RIP
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Wordle 697 4/6
⬜⬜⬜🟩⬜
⬜⬜⬜⬜⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Lucky third guess!
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Wordle 697 4/6*
⬜⬜🟩⬜⬜
⬜⬜🟩⬜🟨
⬜🟩🟩⬜🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Happiness will never come to those who fail to appreciate what they already have. -Anon
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Wordle 697 2/6*
⬜⬜⬜🟨🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
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Wordle 697 4/6
🟨🟩⬛🟩⬛
⬛🟩🟩🟩⬛
⬛🟩🟩🟩⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Ok, I have had my coffee, so you can all come out now!
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Wordle 697 2/6
⬛🟩⬛🟩⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Jeremy Falcon
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Wordle 697 5/6
⬜🟨⬜🟨⬜
🟨⬜🟩⬜⬜
⬜🟩🟩⬜🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
hard one
"A little time, a little trouble, your better day"
Badfinger
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#Worldle #480 2/6 (100%)
🟩🟩⬜⬜⬜➡️
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩🎉
https://worldle.teuteuf.fr
"A little time, a little trouble, your better day"
Badfinger
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I was tracking down the weirdest bug in a circuit I'm building. It was waking up my little MCU seemingly randomly and I couldn't figure it out. It was supposed to wake on button press.
After awhile I realized it would wake up every time I moved, which was weird.
I forgot a pulldown resistor on my button's output line! I was changing the ambient electrical properties of the environment around the wire whenever I moved, which was kind of cool.
It's due to the fact that there's a touch sensor attached to the MCU's input pin I was using for the button. That's fine, but you need a pulldown resistor!
I guess I could use this "bug" to make a digital theramin.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
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