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A fine band, very popular here in Chicago. They had a unique almost midwestern sound that appealed to me. 'Behind the Wall of Sleep' a great song, sadly applies today. 
"the debugger doesn't tell me anything because this code compiles just fine" - random QA comment
"Facebook is where you tell lies to your friends. Twitter is where you tell the truth to strangers." - chriselst
"I don't drink any more... then again, I don't drink any less." - Mike Mullikins uncle
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The who? ![Badger | [badger,badger,badger,badger...]](https://codeproject.global.ssl.fastly.net/script/Forums/Images/badger.gif)
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OK, so years ago, I was a huge fan of the original Gran Turismo game and owned it on a PS2, played the hell out of it and enjoyed it immensely. At the time it was a big expenditure for me (50 EUR for the game, 300 EUR for the console) but it was worth every penny.
Now just this month, wandering around my local shop/warehouse, I spotted the PS4 running Gran Turismo Sport in demo mode, and started slavering. I can't stop thinking about it, it looks awesome and I'm getting nostalgia in the worst way. I have this tradition of buying myself one utterly useless and completely luxurious thing/toy on Christmas (within reason), so I'm seriously considering investing in a PS4. My question is: should I stick with a PS4 slim for a couple hundred bucks? Or spring for the PS4 with its 4k display, massive processing power etc?
The price difference is pretty steep... I can get a reconditioned PS4 here for around 200 CHF, and a new PS4 Pro is more like 379 CHF.
The dude in the shop reckons I HAVE to go for the PS4 Pro, but then he would, wouldn't he. I'm wondering if there is a worthwhile and noticeable difference in rendering speed. I already have a 4K TV, and my eyesight is thankfully still very keen. So I would notice a real difference.
I am also considering investing in the VR headset, which looks badass, and hell, I might even go for the full experience with a flightstick for flight sims, a wheel and pedals. Always had a secret desire to have a fully kitted out ManCave. If I do that though I'm gonna be running up a bill of close to 1000 CHF for my little Geek Paradise. On the other hand, it will definitely keep me at home, out of the pub, I'll save on food because I'll probably never leave the flat, or eat, or sleep again...
I can afford it, so it's more a question of "You can, but you probably shouldn't..."
Anyone have any experience with the difference between the Ps4 and Ps4 Pro?
One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas, I don't know.
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Mel Padden wrote: I was a huge fan of the original Gran Turismo game and owned it on a PS2
Um... I have no valuable input, but that was at least version 3 or 4, not the original. Unless you played PS1 games on the PS2 (who am I to judge - I did it  ).
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IIRC I bought the PS1 and then upgraded a couple years later after playing it to death. I was so stoked about getting Gran Turismo that I had it the day it was released in Ireland...
One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas, I don't know.
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No experiences, but read something about it in the German computer magazine c't.
Their conclusion:
It makes only sense to buy a Pro when using a 4K TV or VR. Then they recommend the Pro version.
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If you have a 4k TV the pro could be a better investment.
ps4pro vs ps4 - YouTube[^]
However what you should actually do is get an XBOX ONE X
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I went through the same process as you, except I had the added question of PS4 Pro with Gran Turismo or XBox One X with Forza 7. For you, given the price difference, I'd argue for the PS4 Pro or XBox One X. 4K isn't going away, more content will come out for it, and it will sustain for longer. The only question is how many years until the PS5 comes out? Plus you don't have to get the VR headset right away.
For the normal or pro question... I have decent eyes and while the difference was noticeable, it wasn't nearly as striking as the jump from SD to HD back in the day. How do I know this? Well the one thing that I didn't do right away was enable 4K on the console. I had my TV set up for 4K but apparently one side or the other didn't auto-sense and the option wasn't enabled by default. Check into that for whatever you end up with.
Between PS4 and XBox, the XBox has more under the hood in the processor and graphics department. The inclusion of a 4K blu-ray player in the XBox vs a non-4k in the PS4 wasn't a big factor for me. My thought was, who actually buys physical media anymore? If that is a factor for you, then that might need to consider that as well.
For the available game library, I like PS4 a lot more. For the racing series, I prefer the recent Forza iterations over the Gran Turismo ones. Plus PS4 does VR so much better (also read "it actually has VR"). I also prefer the PS4 controller over the XBox's. Plus back in the PS2/PS3 days, you could do multiplayer without a yearly membership. Not sure if that is still the case with the PS4 though.
Media Center wise, I like the One X options a little more. That said I wish Microsoft would stop tweaking the layout so often.
And you won't save any money on food, instead of being out at the pub you'll just order in so you don't have to pause the game to cook. 
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Mel Padden wrote: I can get a reconditioned PS4 here for around 200 CHF
Just a hint about reconditioned : If you are interested in playing online - which is usually the case with games like GT, pay attention to reconditioned PS4 -> Lots of them are "banned" or "blocked"[^], so that you cannot play online anymore - which is also why they are sometimes cheap. Unblocking is complicated or even impossible. My BIL bought one for his son, turned out it was a banned one, so now he has to pay the debts of the previous owner (you read that well), or it will remain blocked and his son cannot do any online multiplaying. 
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Just to stir a little more confusion - did you consider Xbox One X? If you enjoyed GT then the game of choice in your case would be Forza Motorsport 7 that on the "X" is enhanced with better graphics to native 4k running smoothly at 60 FPS 
OK, I don't own playstation but I have first-hand experience between Xbox One and Xbox One X. Just a note that the "X" is a bit more powerful than PS4 Pro but overall comparison should be quite similar.
- You are unlikely to notice difference in graphincs unless you run the same game side by side on both consoles. Yes, enhanced games look better, have better textures, shadows, reflections and so on, but are you likely spot that in the middle of battle if you don't have anything to compare?
- Overall performance is much better. Games are pretty well optimized on consoles but slight hiccups happen. On better console they happen less often on non-enhanced games. On enhanced ones overall quality is bumped up so frame drops can still happen although from experience less often.
- Loading times on Xbox One X are much faster - not sure if it extends to PS4 Pro as well, but more power means faster processing so I guess yes.
To sum it up - if you can afford it go for Pro/X version, especially if you have 4k TV already. If you are not yet locked into playstation then do some research first. Look up comparisons between PS4 / PS4 Pro / Xbox One X.
Two more notes at the end:
1. Unless game is "enhanced" there will be no difference on better console other than faster load times and less frame rate drops. More and more games gets enhaced however.
2. PS4 Pro doesn't go for native 4k on enhanced games - it upscales from 1080p. Xbox One X runs native 4k on many enhanced games.
--
"My software never has bugs. It just develops random features."
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I just loved the "feel" of the original Gran Turismo. I've tried Forza, and it's fine, but doesn't blow my socks off. Also, I already have a good PC so I can play most games that come out for XBox, albeit with variable quzality. But for PS games I need the hardware, and the only way i can justify the expense is if there's something that i reeeealy want to play on PS that I can't anywhere else. That something is Gran Turismo.
One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas, I don't know.
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I hear it lets your code be both c# and vb.net.
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Only until you peer-review it.
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
- Benjamin Disraeli
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Kevin McFarlane wrote: How long before we see job ads saying "must have 6 months' commercial experience in Q#?" 
I predict less than a week.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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Kevin McFarlane wrote: How long before we see job ads saying "must have 6 months' commercial experience in Q#?"
We won't: observing such an ad will fix it's state to C++ or C#.
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Kevin
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Kevin McFarlane wrote: How long before we see job ads saying "must have 6 months' commercial experience in Q#?"
6 months! you got it easy there.
Here they will ask for minimum "2 years experience" ... and that requirement will appear in ads 6 months from now.
(recently saw a "5+ years windows 10" experience for a lead programmer.
(Saddest part of that is the agencies here are [all] so useless an applicant (of the many here with amazing resume writing skills and nothing else) will ace that and all the other requirements.
Signature ready for installation. Please Reboot now.
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Lopatir wrote: "5+ years windows 10"
Duh, forget that!
I am a megapro in Windows New Technology!
... such stuff as dreams are made on
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Lopatir wrote: (recently saw a "5+ years windows 10" experience for a lead programmer.
I remember being told of a requirement for 10 years of .NET in about 2002.
Kevin
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It is fun, and not fun. 
The sh*t I complain about
It's like there ain't a cloud in the sky and it's raining out - Eminem
~! Firewall !~
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From a glance at the documentation I am in a superposition of understanding and not understanding, with a bias towards the latter!
Kevin
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Cool instead of threads you now have strings...string theory to a whole new level.
In the IDE each tab is an alternate dimension and the new theme is Dark Matter.
Someone's therapist knows all about you!
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Mike Hankey wrote: Dark Matter.
I was sooo disappointed they cancelled that show! 
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What is it with # as a suffix in language names?
C#, I totally get - in music, C# is an augmented C and that's totally descriptive of the intent of the language. C# is a really good name!
J# kind of stretches the pun a bit as J isn't a note but at least it suggests some kind of augmented Java.
With F# it starts getting a bit weird as I don't think that F# has anything to do with F but at least you can find it on a piano keyboard.
Q# isn't related to Q and isn't a note either.
It just seems to get more tenuous as it goes along.
For what it's worth, I'd have called it "Quark" and sat back to enjoy the ensuing "kwork vs. kwark" pronunciation debates on Code Project.
98.4% of statistics are made up on the spot.
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