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Stefan_Lang wrote: that for VPN I need to choose a provider.
Which means you're issue of caring about who has what data is still there. Now, it will be a VPN provider who sees your data. 
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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True. But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data. My greatest fear isn't so much who sees it now, but who may be gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future. With most internet companies located in the US, any of them might hand over data about me to any three letter 'intelligence' organization on a whim. Also, hackers have the nasty habit of breaking into even the most secured databases, and they may have even worse ideas about what they could do with it.
Data that isn't stored, can't be handed over, or stolen.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Stefan_Lang wrote: But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data.
Supposedly is the keyword there.
Stefan_Lang wrote: gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future.
I guess I have no imagination on this subject. What possible darker reasons are there? What are you actually concerned might happen? (Not looking to fight, I genuinely don't know.)
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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RyanDev wrote: What possible darker reasons are there?
To be honest, I have trouble coming up with a concrete example. But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one.
As a programmer, I try to watch out for unexpected errors. I don't know what bugs the programs I write will expose in the future. It's not that I built them into the program on purpose, but I simply didn't forsee the specific circumstances causing an issue. Therefore I take precautions to restrict the likelyhood of bugs, and the effect that they can have.
As a private person, I watch out for unexpected ways others can take advantage of me. Unfortunately I don't have a sufficiently dark mind to think of all such possibilities. Therefore, as a precaution, I try to keep as much of my personal information close to me as possible. That way I am offering a smaller attack surface, and I limit the potential damage others could cause me.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Stefan_Lang wrote: But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one.
Of course.
I feel like this is similar to if someone wanted to come by my house and take a picture of my grass or my tree.
What specific data are you concerned about? What sites you are seeing? I'm not even sure what else they could get.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Ah, you're thinking of browsing. I'm more concerned about stuff like Microsofts CompatTelRunner that does scan your entire hard disks even if you don't participate in CEIP. MS states that (1) it should only be running if you participate, which is a blatant lie, (2) that you can uninstall and hide the related KB update(s), which doesn't help since they wrapped up all KB updates in the cumulative updates, and hidden updates will keep getting unhidden on a regular basis, (3) that it doesn't report any data that I should be concerned about, which I don't believe because of (1) and (2).
Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Stefan_Lang wrote: Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
So, you're concerned they might send your Microsoft Money file to their servers? Technically, any program you install on your PC has the capability to do that.
But that's fair.
A couple of times I've had charges show up on my credit card that I did not do. First time I called and disputed. Gone. Second time, I did it online. No big deal. Not that it couldn't be worse but I guess I don't see it as enough of a threat to worry too much about it.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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RyanDev wrote: So, you're concerned they might send your Microsoft Money file to their servers?
Erm, no. I'm not so much concerned over data they send to their servers, but third parties hacking their servers and doing real bad stuff with it.
MS might be using my data to take advantage of me, but I trust they won't do it in such a big way that it hurts me real bad - after all they've still got some reputation (and money) left to lose. But others may have less scruples.
But all of this is missing the point. I was looking for advice on VPN, not to discuss privacy. I am concerned, for various reasons. VPN seems a good way to reduce the risks. I am well aware that it may not solve the issue entirely, but I rather do something than nothing at all.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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I disabled the CompatTelRunner service only to find it had been re-enabled a few days later. Seems as if the only sure way is to pull the RJ45 out.
We're philosophical about power outages here. A.C. come, A.C. go.
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If you don't uninstall the related Windows kb updates, it will be re-enabled automatically.
If you don't hide them after uninstallation, they will be reinstalled with the next Windows update.
Even if you hide them, they will be unhidden with the next Windows update rollup.
Personally, I switched to manual updates, and when I do an update I will remove the pests that I don't want afterwards:
Quote: KB971033 Description of the update for Windows Activation Technologies
KB2952664 Compatibility update for upgrading Windows 7
KB2990214 Update that enables you to upgrade from Windows 7 to a later version of Windows
KB3021917 Update for Windows Customer Experience Improvement Program
KB3022345 Update for customer experience and diagnostic telemetry
KB3035583 Update installs Get Windows 10 app in Windows 8.1 and Windows 7 SP1
KB3044374 Update that enables you to upgrade from Windows 8.1 to a later version of Windows
KB3068708 Update for customer experience and diagnostic telemetry
KB3075249 Update that adds telemetry points to consent.exe in Windows 8.1 and Windows 7
KB3080149 (update for CEIP and telemetry)
(taken from Meine Methode die Telemetrydatenerfassung au… | Forum - heise online[^] ; also see Windows update KB2952664 (Compattelrunner.exe) cannot be uninstalled from Windows 7 - Super User[^] )
I expect this method will keep working for Windows 7 until MS stops rolling out updates.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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In this case, you should not use a VPN to provide protection since VPN are not visible to applications, anything "your" application can do can also be done by third party applications ...
I have not think this way before, but I belief there should be a solution to this problem using security gateways (black list them is one of potential the solution). But it's not build in yet, I will think about it
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I always thought "what faster way to 'innovate' than to steal the ideas of programmers everywhere?" Better yet, their working code.
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Stefan_Lang wrote: many of them don't actually store these data
You just don't know it.
Stefan_Lang wrote: Data that isn't stored, can't be handed over, or stolen.
What about hand over on the fly 
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Shuqian Ying wrote: Stefan_Lang wrote: many of them don't actually store these data
You just don't know it.
Its' all about trust. If it turns out a VPN provider was lying about some relevant aspect of his business, that would ruin his business. I don't trust in VPN providers as much as the fact that they can't afford to compromise that trust.
Shuqian Ying wrote: What about hand over on the fly
I would consider that less of a problem, since I'm much more concerned about data sitting around in a database somewhere, waiting to be hacked by malicious third parties.
Also, what would be the point? If someone wanted to spy on traffic to and from me, he'd need to know my identity anyway, breaking the main layer of protection that a VPN provides. At that point, rather than spying on 193 VPN servers all over the world they could just ask my ISP to hand over the streams.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Multi years user of PIA, no issues - they allow 5 devices to be set up, and they can be used in parallel (sometimes I also use it on my android phone for gelocation specific apps - like streaming sports - I watch a brand of footy that's free to stream if you're "in Europe." - UK, Germany, Netherlands ... PIA lots of locations to choose from.)
But, even before that: a lot of the data ms collects can already be blocked
- disabling some task scheduler jobs
- and using the windows firewall (firewall with advanced security - free, already built-in)
1. set it to filter outbound as well as in-bound connections
2. but then you will need to add rules, for say your browser
- see next paragraph to make that easier
3. then disable some of the default outbound firewall rules (need to experiment which matter or not).
On top of firewall with advanced security I use WFN (free, source code available) which shows a nice popup whenever any program without a rule tries to open a outbound connection, options to allow/block permanent/temporary (it writes the firewall rules for you)
- for instance your browser needs to be able to connect outbound
start the browser, click allow on the popup - done.
- microsoft office apps absolutely do not (o2016 - no problems killing it's outbound)!
start word, click deny on the popup, done! (need to do separartelt for excel etc)
- some installers may need an outbound connection: use a temporary rule, WFN cleans it up by clicking the notification icon. Antivirus wants to update definitions - temporary rule....
As a final step, don't use your ISP's DNS servers (they also usually use/report what you've been looking for - and if done a deal with ms they share the data with them), set the DNS server to some other reputable public servers (i.e. open DNS: 208.67.222.222, google 8.8.8.8) - network adapter settings - IPv4 - properties
Sin tack
the any key okay
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Thank you for writing up all that advice. I'll see if I can make something of that - as I mentioned above, I'm not very familiar with all these networking options.
WFN sounds nice: we already had to adjust the router firewall settings because it blocked a program. Sounds like WFN is just the right program to deal with these kind of things.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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I'm a big fan of Nord. I've used them for over a year and am very happy with their performance.
/ravi
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Sheer coincidence that my PIA is due for renewal again
Ravi: plus my thanks for the recco of Nord.
hate auto renewal (your payment details on file), so had disabled that on PIA
- now getting nags: 'reminder: only a few days left'
- no standard option for one-off payment (re-sub, allow payment, unsub - still you get the full year usage but with nags)
Time to go shopping: summary Nord vs PIA: (seems to be the 2 best from reviews)
speed/feat/service: equivalent.
PIA slightly cheaper (not by much) ...
... but now: Nord 2 years 72% off (even go direct without the coupons): nice timing.
- realise Nord also want payment details on file - let's see how that goes
back thought: hope Nord deep discounts are not signs they are going down.
Sin tack
the any key okay
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Lopatir wrote: realise Nord also want payment details on file
I use my PayPal account to pay them.
/ravi
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You can setup your own on cloud, I have done this and able to VPN my way out of blocks (Even in China).
I have 2 VPNs setup, one in USA (Ubuntu VM, AWS - Free!!) and another one in Singapore (Win Server VM, Azure)
I have setup OpenVPN access server on both.
Here is a guide I followed for setting up VPN on AWS[^]
The link for setting up on windows is dead now, though I have it on my onenote, I can provide it if you need.
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I used AirVPN for a couple of years mostly for Netflix. Wasn't completely seamless, but got the job done.
Was cheap enough, but no idea how trustworthy the guy is.
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To those who are interested in this topic, here is some useful information I found:
After following a couple of links provided here, and searching for various services, I stumbled upon That One Privacy Site[^], which has an excellent informative section about the things to watch out for when selecting a VPN service.
Even better it provides a huge sheet that shows how well 179(!) existing VPN services fare with regard to these things.
What convinced me most about the usefulness of this site is how it perfectly describes some of my experiences I had when trying to find more information: That One Privacy Site | That One Privacy Guy’s VPN Reviews[^] . For those who start out like me, I recommend a visit to this site, if only to get an idea what to expect.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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I'm running OpenDNS's Simple DNSCrypt to keep my ISP from snooping the packets of my DNS requests, which is still possible if you only use someone else's DNS servers (Google's, OpenDNS's, etc.)
I recently became aware of and am considering FreedomBox which you can run on a RasPi among other hardware. Many features/services to choose from, VPN amongst them. Check out their FAQ page. Using the ad blocker has to make up for at least some of the lost speed, with some pages more than make up for.
I used to run the UTM, Untangle, but changed the box I was running it on to be a small domain controller. A RasPi would be a much more energy efficient appliance these days.
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