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Personally I consider "software engineer" to be a case of buzzword bingo, just like "software developer" or "rockstar". Before these fluff phrases came into existence, "programmer" implied not just syntax and "details", but also spending time considering the big picture.
Honestly, since when did programming ever not involve "designing and understanding complex mechanisms. The architecture. The guts of the machine"? It always meant that. Don't let recruiter-speak diminish the meaning of "programmer".
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Can it be cured? 
If you have an important point to make, don't try to be subtle or clever. Use a pile driver. Hit the point once. Then come back and hit it again. Then hit it a third time - a tremendous whack.
--Winston Churchill
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So THAT is how cat food is made...
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Hello Everyone,
I have some idea of javascript and jQuery as in I can get the work done. But I feel like there is no way past it. I have to know it better if it is going to be this relevant.
So here I am, open to suggestions about the best place to start. I did some research online and found that quite a lot of people endorse Javascript: The good parts and You don't know JS to be the best.
I trust CP the most because I know people here have been through this dilemma. So how did you do it?
Where did you start?
I am not the one who knocks. I never knock.
In fact, I hate knocking.
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Caveat - I have not been through this dilemma, I am currently resisting anything to do with the web stack since they trashed Silverlight.
However I think there are very few here who endorse JavaScript, there are many who would like to stab it through the heart or burn it at the stake.
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity
RAH
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Mycroft Holmes wrote: many who would like to stab it through the heart or burn it at the stake.
I doubt it.
Far too quick an end for it. How about a very slow steam roller running it over, starting with it's "toes"?
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Like this?[^]
If the brain were so simple we could understand it, we would be so simple we couldn't. — Lyall Watson
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Nah, the roller was moving far, far too fast.
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Is there no Sarlacc pit nearby?
Quote: "In its belly, you will find a new definition of pain and suffering as you are slowly digested over a…thousand years."
―C-3PO translating for Jabba the Hutt
I have lived with several Zen masters - all of them were cats.
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Mycroft Holmes wrote: Caveat - I have not been through this dilemma, I am currently resisting anything to do with the web stack since they trashed Silverlight.
well it was a microsoft product, what did you expect?
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I hate JavaScript like the plague, so I can't tell you any resources you could try. My way of learning is time consuming: Start a pet project, set your goals high and don't even try to stay on the beaten path. Don't look so much at tutorials. Choose a design and try to implement it yourself.
Yor first shot will most probably not be perfect, but running into problems is the whole point. Don't get frustrated and go out of your way with refactoring or redesigning until you can live with the results. Go as far as starting all over again when you feel you have reached a dead end. This way you will gain a good understanding of the language, the framework and the tools at your disposal.
Speaking of that, frameworks and tools come and go, especially with javaScript. Don't waste too much time on them and try to focus on things that stay, like algorithms, design and architecture. Then learning yet another way to do the same old stuff will not be much of a problem.
I have lived with several Zen masters - all of them were cats.
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Don't learn - just copy-paste from SO and hack at it until it sort of works.
That's what everyone else is jDoing.
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Well, to preface this... I've been using JavaScript since the 90s, then a few years back I learned way more than I ever thought I knew about it from a super smart coworker at the time. So only doing really hardcore stuff for only a few years now.
But, I'll say this. The web is sporadic. People don't really take the time to write well thought out content like a book does. Back in the 90s the best book I ever read on the subject was called the JavaScript Bible. It's still around actually if you get a newer edition, since it's has had 7 revisions. Things have changed now, so I'm sure there are a number of good books on the subject.
My advice, get a good book on plain vanilla JavaScript and start a personal project to work on with it. Reading stuff online alone won't really teach you much. You have to work on a project.
Also, as much as I love jQuery... I still use it a lot but it is dying as some of issues it addressed are being handled by native JavaScript these days. So, if I had to learn it all again, personally I'd start with vanilla JavaScript. Spend some time with it. Understand the semantics of the language (they're different because JavaScript is more functional then OOP) and only after a solid foundation would I consider building on top of that with libraries like jQuery.
Not really sure what interests you, but a suitable project to learn with would of course be a client-heavy one, such as a game. If you're looking for ideas, see if you can make a Tetris clone in pure JavaScript for instance. Those are always fun.
And remember, to get most things done in JavaScript you use callbacks and function chains like crack cocaine due to its functional nature, much like you would with LINQ chaining in C#. And by default, every last remote call is async. If you need to update the DOM based on a remote API call for instance it helps to remember that.
Jeremy Falcon
modified 8-Nov-17 3:13am.
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I have been reviewing some code from google music lab's experimental music projects. It's really interesting.
I am not the one who knocks. I never knock.
In fact, I hate knocking.
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Yeah, people don't realize how much Google has helped the web. They have a ton of awesome APIs they expose to the public. If it turns out being a fun project, I'd be interested to see what comes of it.
Jeremy Falcon
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Thanks, learning vanilla JS is really the way to go.
I am not the one who knocks. I never knock.
In fact, I hate knocking.
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Oh, and hard core JavaScript has a high learning curve akin to F#. It's different. Don't worry about the naysayers saying they hate it. It's the defacto language for the client web. The language is pretty nifty but radically different than say C#. In reality, it's the development environments for it that need some work (they're much better this day and age), so get used to using your developer tools in Chrome, etc. as these will literally be a life saver.
Jeremy Falcon
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Thank you, Jeremy.
This is what I actually wanted. As I said, I can get the work done, the problem is that it takes a few tries to make things work and sometimes it's really counter-intuitive (which really means I know zilch).
Learning vanilla JS is what I want to do.
I know that a lot of people hate JS (as do I), but I also understand that there's no way around it,
now that clients want to build their application in the latest new and shining JS framework coz they heard it's "better".
(sigh) nosedive it is then.
I am not the one who knocks. I never knock.
In fact, I hate knocking.
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You're welcome. And, I think you'll learn to like it once you get past the WTFs with the learning curve that is. 
Since it's always fun to see demos, try doing this without JavaScript. It would be impossible...
Tearable Cloth v2[^]
Even if you use WebGL, canvas, et al they are controlled by JavaScript. So learning it is essential for client interactivity.
Jeremy Falcon
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That's so cool. 
I am not the one who knocks. I never knock.
In fact, I hate knocking.
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*cough* Typescript. Just sayin'.
This space for rent
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It can be a good tool - especially if you are used to typed languages... But, at the end of the day it translated to JS and that what runs on the clients machine, so using TS does not relieve you from learning JS...
Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
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