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So I'm on to the start into a nice weekend of my vacation, working all day long on my carpenters workbench I'm building in my cellar for the last two weeks. For relaxation purposes I wander into the ever surprising world of Q&A. Grey posts where ever I look. OK, some do deserve it maybe, but me thinks there is too much of this going on.
Where the fark are these protector overlords when you need them?
There is more to protecting this site than deleting posts like spam.
Do I need a special activation code?
There are others that have gone before me, so is it really time to move on to greener other pastures?
"I had the right to remain silent, but I didn't have the ability!"
Ron White, Comedian
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I know what you mean, but the Protectors can't do much about that. They cannot see who have downvoted a post.
Soren Madsen
"When you don't know what you're doing it's best to do it quickly" - Jase #DuckDynasty
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There appears to be a group who's instant response to anything that isn't phrased exactly how they like it is to ignore that it is a complete beginner that asked and abuse vote it as "not a question"
I assume that this is a cheap way to accumulate rep points, either that or they are rude arrogant sunshines. Quite possibly both.
I do know that it annoys the elephant out of me, and others - and that it is in no way to the benefit of the site.
Unfortunately there is no information given as to who is doing it, though there are always suspicions.
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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I know what you mean. I've hit the downvote button a fair number of times myself, but only in the cases where the "question" is "How do I write an application?".
There are also those posts where the person thinks they're asking a question, giving some specs or something like that, but they never ask a question. What they're really doing is telling a story and assuming you're going to know the question they don't want to ask. This is happening quite a lot. A ton of people hit downvote on those as well.
Are they correct in doing so?? Hmmm...
It seems every question posted has something wrong with it, but to varying degrees.
I agree, the downvote button is getting hit a bit too much.
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Indeed, "premature eradication" seems to be waxing problem on QA; I recently put my two-farthings worth of ventilated spleen about that on SuggsAndBuggs: [^].
But, even more disturbing, to me, is the pattern, and frequency, of verbal abuse of first-time, or relatively new, posters, many of whom are, obviously, not native English speakers. Some of the questions getting both instantly down-voted, and flamed in an insulting way, are really quite legit.
Responses like this literally make me want to vomit: [^].
I feel strongly that a newcomer to CodeProject should be welcomed in a friendly, but professional way, to what is, at its best, a kind of "virtual community," and "global meeting of minds." If they, then, over time, prove themselves to be a complainer-with-sense-of-entitlement, a lost sheep with no motivation to get found, a parasite, a homework shirker, then, fine: let the boiling tar of down-vote be poured on their heads.
I have said this before (here on the Lounge), and I will say it again: CP is not well-served by the current structure, and administration, of QA, and the reputation system, and I believe there are fairly simple, and low-cost (cost of implementation for CP staff), changes that can be made that will improve its quality for everyone. I have, in the past, described ideas for changes could be in posts to SuggsAndBuggs.
Surely, we, the ten-million, together with CP staff, can collectively address finding the best solution for QA (and its relation to the other forums) ? And, fyi, I don't think that best-solution means turning CP QA into a clone of StackOverFlow (different culture, different planet).
“The best hope is that one of these days the Ground will get disgusted enough just to walk away ~ leaving people with nothing more to stand ON than what they have so bloody well stood FOR up to now.” Kenneth Patchen, Poet
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I substantially agree with you. I have spent a bit of time at Q&A and have a reasonable idea of how it works and the politics involved. Your observation about reputation points is completely valid.
In my opinion over the years the number of really sub-standard questions (perhaps best expressed as a proportion of the total) has grown. A better way of dealing with these would improve the forum immensely.
It is worth noting that the increase in non-questions (those which are completely outside the guidelines) is almost equally matched by an increase in non-answers quite often by reputation hounds.
BTW I agree with your point in the example you give.
Peter Wasser
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
modified 8-Mar-14 20:41pm.
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pwasser wrote: It is worth noting that the increase in non-questions (those which are completely outside the guidelines) is almost equally matched by an increase in non-answers quite often by reputation hounds.
Hi Peter,
Our observations seem congruent: that could mean we're both intelligent, and perceptive, or, both equally biased, deluded, brain-washed, or insane 
The spate of non-answers, off-topic self-aggrandizing mini-sermons, throw-some-links-against-the-wall-and-see-if-anything-sticks, reminds me of Leibniz' concept of psittacism which just happened to be my OED e-mail newsletter word-of-the-day for today:
Leibniz: "Nouveaux essais sur l'entendement humain" (1765) ii. 145). "The mechanical repetition of previously received ideas or images, without true reasoning or feeling; repetition of words or phrases parrot-fashion; an instance of this."
Diagnosis is easy, yes ?
“The best hope is that one of these days the Ground will get disgusted enough just to walk away ~ leaving people with nothing more to stand ON than what they have so bloody well stood FOR up to now.” Kenneth Patchen, Poet
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BillWoodruff wrote: psittacism
I like it.  
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am.
JimmyRopes
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Quote: Responses like this literally make me want to vomit: [^].
Perhaps it has been removed but I read everything on that link and don't see anything worthy of losing my lunch. Can you explain?
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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The abusive answer looks to have been removed. A certain poster basically insulted and belittled a new site member and suggested that they should rip up whatever qualifications they had. There was no charity in the answer and it was completely unnecessary.
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I remember there being at least one other perfectly valid answer, which also appears to have been deleted.
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Click on the question to see the answers. Bill's link takes you to the removed question which hides the other answers.
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Right you are. That doesn't seem like very intuitive behavior. *Off to bugs/suggs*
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Totally agree.
Just take a look at this, for example: How can I combine two .csv files using c#?[^]
Why on earth was that question downvoted?  It was perfectly legitimate. 
QA definitely needs to be more beginner friendly.
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I don't really like that particular question, regardless of the questioner being a beginner. It sounds as if they are not a programmer; they are just a person trying to use programming to get a particular task done. And they've not shown that they've done any work toward attempting to create a programmatic solution (e.g., by saying they can't figure out how to read in the contents of a file). So, they're basically asking for work to be done for them for free.
And that "rush" they describe... shouldn't that be reserved for solutions they come up with? That is, the rush that comes from accomplishment. If not, it seems like the rush they're getting is one of gaining productivity... by having others do work for them.
I didn't downvote them (they explained the problem very well), but I'd certainly have asked them to show me what they had so far before spoon feeding them the answer, and I can understand why somebody else might downvote them.
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That may be a personal view. We are all inclined to read questions and think maybe the poster is a dickhead. However if the question substantially meets the forum guidelines that is irrelevant.
Yes asking for more information is sometimes the way but in the case of this question what more is required?
Peter Wasser
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
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For this question, I'd have asked what they tried (with code samples) and what they're stuck on. Not because I'd need that to answer the question, but because I'd need that to be sure they actually tried.
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AspDotNetDev wrote: It sounds as if they are not a programmer; they are just a person trying to use programming to get a particular task done
Why is this a problem? Am I not allowed to ask questions if I'm not having a degree in computer science? We need less elitism, not more.
AspDotNetDev wrote: And they've not shown that they've done any work toward attempting to create a programmatic solution
If I know that I'm lacking the knowledge, I'm explaining the situation and my needs first to save time. Showing a non functional solution that's probably off won't help a bit.
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Jörgen Andersson wrote: Why is this a problem? Am I not allowed to ask questions if I'm not having a degree in computer science?
If they are not a programmer, they are trying to get non-programming tasks done programmatically. This implies that they aren't trying to learn the craft, but are instead trying to get work done for them for free.
Jörgen Andersson wrote: If I know that I'm lacking the knowledge, I'm explaining the situation and my needs first to save time. Showing a non functional solution that's probably off won't help a bit.
The point isn't for it to help in producing an answer (though, often it does). In this case, it would be to show that the OP actually tried before asking for help.
The basic issue I take with that particular question is that the OP was asking for a solution, not an answer to a particular problem. They didn't say, "I don't know how to open a file" or "I don't know how to append two strings". They presented a spec and expected a solution that fit that spec. Like I said, that's work for free.
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A simple yes would have sufficed.
AspDotNetDev wrote: The basic issue I take with that particular question is that the OP was asking for a solution, not an answer to a particular problem. They didn't say, "I don't know how to open a file" or "I don't know how to append two strings". They presented a spec and expected a solution that fit that spec. Like I said, that's work for free.
Sometimes presenting a spec is the simplest way to explain your problem and what solution you need. You can still give an answer that gives them the info they need to know to solve it themselves.
You also Always have the third option, to move on.
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AspDotNetDev wrote: I don't really like that particular question, regardless of the questioner being a beginner. It sounds as if they are not a programmer; they are just a person trying to use programming to get a particular task done.
Sounds like DD! so what is your point? 
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am.
JimmyRopes
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Any more than 3? Or is that the last of the subscriber base? 
(See the post below if you wonder where I got 3 from.....)
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Anorexics Of Louisiana, there's got to be more than 3? 
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LA is among the most obese states in the nation. No anorexics there. 
Sometimes the true reward for completing a task is not the money, but instead the satisfaction of a job well done. But it's usually the money.
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Hey, I am proud AOL user. I use my AOL email for all unwanted registrations like Adobe. It just works.
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