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mark merrens wrote: Sorry, forgot to put a smiley on the end of that!
No problem.
Personally I've never been in favor of the voting system we have on CP. It just results in so much negativity. Instead of a + / - system, I'd prefer a + only system. The good posts and the good articles get + votes, the ordinary ones get nothing, while the spam/abuse gets reported as such (not via a - vote but via a simple report button).
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There were some suggestions as to how best handle this but nothing has been done. I'm thinking CP was hoping it would just go away.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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Chris had looked into the same thing for me yesterday.
someone has been following me around for a few days downvoting me. I think he reached out to the individual. It seems to have helped...for now. 
"the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)
"It is the celestial scrotum of good luck!" - Nagy Vilmos (2011)
"But you probably have the smoothest scrotum of any grown man" - Pete O'Hanlon (2012)
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I don't care about down-voting a specific post (I usually deserve it). What I thoroughly object to is a a person deliberately going through all of your posts and hitting them. I've had it a few times and think there is a better way to handle it than just ignoring it.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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mark merrens wrote: What I thoroughly object to is a a person deliberately going through all of your posts and hitting them.
exactly what I'm talking about.
I don't care about the sporadic downvote or even a series of downvotes. However, it bothers me a bit when it goes on for few days time.
"the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)
"It is the celestial scrotum of good luck!" - Nagy Vilmos (2011)
"But you probably have the smoothest scrotum of any grown man" - Pete O'Hanlon (2012)
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mark merrens wrote: I've had it a few times and think there is a better way to handle it than just ignoring it.
Should I send you a memo each time I personally and privately reach out to an individual who is abusing the system?
cheers,
Chris Maunder
The Code Project | Co-founder
Microsoft C++ MVP
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Well, as nice as that would be I think not - perhaps opt me onto the board would be easier. It does imply, however, that you are having to do this a lot.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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mark merrens wrote: It does imply, however, that you are having to do this a lot
I don't see that what I wrote implies that at all.
cheers,
Chris Maunder
The Code Project | Co-founder
Microsoft C++ MVP
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So how often do you have to do this?
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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Have this discussion about how knowing who downvoted you would help you shape your discussions appropriately? About once a month.
Oooh. You mean talk to someone discreetly? Not often at all.
cheers,
Chris Maunder
The Code Project | Co-founder
Microsoft C++ MVP
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I have to say that was me who upvoted you for that. But you already knew that... 
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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mark merrens wrote: Many of us came up with suggestions as to how best to address it but that appears to have been ignored
I've answered your suggestions[^] and we had a good long discussion about the problems involved. As I've said before, I prioritise the issues that occur based on how it affects the operation for the majority of users.
If you have a specific set of downvotes you feel are suspicious then I'll investigate. In looking through your rep I'm seeing a half dozen downvotes in fairly contentious threads in the Soapbox.
Voting abuse is not getting downvoted by someone who you're arguing with in the Soapbox. That's called "expressing a view", albeit anonymously and in a fairly cowardly manner. Voting abuse is getting all your mates to upvote an article, or alternatively downvoting someone elses article, or downvoting all the messages in a forum or thread indiscriminately.
So: my answer to your previous complaint was: "I'd be willing to entertain the idea of allowing newbies up-votes only, and then when they have enough points, they get downvote ability too."
You must understand, though, that the downvotes you received would still be anonymous based on the rep of those who downvoted you. So I would have spent a fair bit of time working to put together a solution that would not solve your problem. The solution to your problem is either don't post stuff that will get you downvoted (no fun!), or only post stuff that will get you downvoted in a forum that doesn't have voting (ie The Backroom) or not have downvotes at all. And I want downvotes. I want members to be able to show disapproval and approval. I'm not throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
cheers,
Chris Maunder
The Code Project | Co-founder
Microsoft C++ MVP
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Chris Maunder wrote: You must understand, though, that the downvotes you received would still be anonymous based on the rep of those who downvoted you.
And therein lies the real problem: anonymous voting. Many years ago you stopped anyone voting who was not logged in. If we knew who was voting it would encourage the person voting to offer a reason and/or stop frivolous or vindictive voting. Sock puppets would be obvious: they either have a history of only down-voting or this is their first and only post.
If I have a discussion with someone, face to face, we both have to take responsibility for that conversation. That is entirely one-sided here: any member, for any reason can come along and down-vote a post and we are not even allowed to challenge that or ask the reason why? That is wrong and it encourages people to bite their tongue rather than expressing a proper view or opinion. Is that what you are aiming for? I shouldn't have to think about where I post to attempt to mimimize the reaction in case a moral coward decides he doesn't like not just this post, but any others he can down vote even if they are not related.
Perhaps the real solution here is to solicit a vote of members. Ask everyone to vote on which of several preferences they would prefer to deal with this.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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cf. Previous discussion on this[^] and the messages following that post.
cheers,
Chris Maunder
The Code Project | Co-founder
Microsoft C++ MVP
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Still, nothing has changed. Why not put a few options to the membership: see what your users and supporters would like to happen. Can't see why that would be a problem.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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Chris Maunder wrote: I'm not throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Well, some of us feel there's no baby in there - just bath water.
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Why cant we have the info of who voted what? Who gave what rating? Even i tried to figure out why my posts were downvoted and when i ask for a reason, no one replied back.
Naina
Naina
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Simple answer? Human nature. If you see that someone has downvoted you, there will always be a temptation to downvote them in retaliation. I would rather not know who downvoted my posts in order not to engage in this type of behaviour. The other reason is that this will result in a number of sockpuppet accounts being created to continue the attack. In other words, you will still have no idea who did it.
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And yet knowing might discourage random voting. It has to be better than what we have now. Nothing.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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How old are you?
I've always assumed you were in your 30's yet your wiseness never seems to amaze me.
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Faintly Peculiar wrote: your wiseness never seems to amaze me
Seriously? You also think he's a patronizing, smarmy git? Nice.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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At the end of the day it is just a post(not an article) that is being downvoted. It has taken you a maximum of two minutes to compose so what if it gets downvoted? The more you bring attention to how you dislike it the more the culprit/culprits are going to enjoy inflicting the one-vote on you.
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That's not the point (and it isn't just posts, it happens to people's articles as well). I don't care about the points (they don't pay my bills) but I am curious about people's motivation: if I were having a conversation, face-to-face, then people would not act in this manner: it seems the internet allows people to behave rudely and cowardly. Why should someone be able to down vote and run? If they knew that we would know who they are then they may be more reluctant to vote without giving a reason. Yes, you will get the odd sock puppet but that would be fairly easy to figure out and remove.
Doing nothing about this will not make it go away.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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mark merrens wrote: Doing nothing about this will not make it go away.
I would disagree; the more fuss people make about this the more it encourages these scrotes to continue trying to wind us up. Just accept it as part of being a member of an open community, and focus on something important[^].
Binding 100,000 items to a list box can be just silly regardless of what pattern you are following. Jeremy Likness
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It's important to me and I'm not that bothered about the wind up, I am concerned that doing nothing encourages the behavior.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair.
nils illegitimus carborundum
me, me, me
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