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GeneralRe: Microsoft has a controversial suggestion for managers Pin
abmv3-Apr-22 17:17
professionalabmv3-Apr-22 17:17 
GeneralRe: Microsoft has a controversial suggestion for managers Pin
Dan Neely4-Apr-22 2:58
Dan Neely4-Apr-22 2:58 
GeneralRe: Microsoft has a controversial suggestion for managers Pin
obermd4-Apr-22 3:37
obermd4-Apr-22 3:37 
GeneralRe: Microsoft has a controversial suggestion for managers Pin
Daniel Pfeffer4-Apr-22 9:03
professionalDaniel Pfeffer4-Apr-22 9:03 
NewsWhy APL is a language worth knowing Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
Mike Hankey3-Apr-22 11:58
mveMike Hankey3-Apr-22 11:58 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
Daniel Pfeffer3-Apr-22 19:31
professionalDaniel Pfeffer3-Apr-22 19:31 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
trønderen3-Apr-22 21:10
trønderen3-Apr-22 21:10 
Look up just about any (non-trivial) mathematical proof, and it is "obfuscated" in the same manner: A lot of strange symbols that - to most non-mathematicians - make no sense whatsoever.

APL wasn't developed as a programming language, but as a notation for blackboard teaching of advanced math topics. The math students had to learn the meaning of a few extra symbols, in addition to the plethora of symbols they already knew.

Most APL critics would consider the language to be less obfuscated if you simply replaced the special APL characters with word symbols (such as 'reshape', 'execute', 'invert', ...). Yet, when reading math, they can easily handle sigma, integration sign, delta, root sign, pi, e and i symbols, without complaining about 'obfuscation'.

If you learn the symbols of APL, the language still has elements that differ from the 'Algol type' languages. (Today, few people ever saw an Algol program, so let us call it 'C type' Smile | :) ). E.g. no operator priorities. Functions and values exist in a 'workspace', with no defined 'ordering' as a source file. Many (most) operators work on an entire matrix of arbitrary dimension, rather than iterating over the elements. These are examples of different approaches to programming, but they can hardly be called 'obfuscation'. If you say that they are, then any significant deviation from 'c style' could be called 'obfuscation'.

Lots of people have no need for learning calculus, so they don't need to know integration and sigma and delta and root symbols. We should accept that. We should also accept that many (probably the great majority of) programmers have no need to learn the symbolism for expressing matrix operations in a programming language made for that kind of problems. We should accept that as well.

If a non-mathematician looks at a differential equation and calls it 'obfuscated', mathematicians would probably just reply with a forgiving smile. If a non-APLer looks at an APL program and calls it 'obfuscated', the APL programmer would reply similarly.
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
den2k883-Apr-22 23:12
professionalden2k883-Apr-22 23:12 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
Daniel Pfeffer4-Apr-22 1:09
professionalDaniel Pfeffer4-Apr-22 1:09 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
obermd4-Apr-22 3:34
obermd4-Apr-22 3:34 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
RickZeeland3-Apr-22 22:13
mveRickZeeland3-Apr-22 22:13 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
obermd4-Apr-22 3:35
obermd4-Apr-22 3:35 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
Marc Clifton4-Apr-22 5:27
mvaMarc Clifton4-Apr-22 5:27 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
trønderen4-Apr-22 11:21
trønderen4-Apr-22 11:21 
GeneralRe: Why APL is a language worth knowing Pin
dlhale6-Apr-22 6:59
dlhale6-Apr-22 6:59 
NewsReport: Small businesses receive 350% more social engineering attacks than enterprises, mostly from Microsoft impersonators Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31 
GeneralRe: Report: Small businesses receive 350% more social engineering attacks than enterprises, mostly from Microsoft impersonators Pin
obermd4-Apr-22 3:25
obermd4-Apr-22 3:25 
NewsGitHub Copilot Labs Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31 
News‘Magnetic turd’: scientists invent moving slime that could be used in human digestive systems Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:31 
NewsReport: Microsoft adds new Android division following internal reorg Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:16
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:16 
GeneralRe: Report: Microsoft adds new Android division following internal reorg Pin
Dan Neely4-Apr-22 3:01
Dan Neely4-Apr-22 3:01 
NewsMicrosoft may not offer you Windows 11 if you use Internet Explorer Pin
Kent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:16
staffKent Sharkey3-Apr-22 10:16 
GeneralRe: Microsoft may not offer you Windows 11 if you use Internet Explorer Pin
obermd4-Apr-22 3:39
obermd4-Apr-22 3:39 
NewsScientists discover a new "speed limit" for all electronic devices Pin
Kent Sharkey31-Mar-22 9:31
staffKent Sharkey31-Mar-22 9:31 

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