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honey the codewitch22-Jul-21 3:56

22-Jul-21 3:56

Yeah, that's my concern.

The other issue I didn't mention in the OP is if I can I'd like to keep access to most of the technology I've used in this.

So what I think I might do, while a bit risky, gives me the best of both worlds.

I'm going to open source enough of the components for this software that someone who was dedicated and smart could use them to build another one.

But I won't release them all until just before I approach those companies so nobody has time to compete with me.

I'll also, as I alluded to above, hold enough back of the e-reader code itself that I'm both providing actual value to those companies, and fending off potential competitors.

Real programmers use butterflies

Do not escape reality : improve reality !

Rage22-Jul-21 3:59

Rage

22-Jul-21 3:59

Sounds like a plan Thumbs Up | :thumbsup:

Chris Maunder22-Jul-21 1:58

Chris Maunder

22-Jul-21 1:58

I'd have some conversations and get a feel for what your participation could be worth. What's the market for e-readers? Does that fact that everyone has a phone make them redundant? Is there a new product type that's waiting for oxygen?

My 2c is that if you truly, deeply want to commercialise your code then do it, and don't mess around. You'll need a hardware partner, you'll need a story, a very tight target market focus (to keep your story on track and to avoid 'everything to everyone' trap which results in 'nothing to anyone') and a "why" for the e-reader makes complete and obvious sense.

If you're after simply licensing the code then that's way easier. A hardware manufacture licenses your code, you get royalties, and you're done. Evidently 10% is average on software, but I didn't dig deep and that would probably be on net sales, which could be tricky if this is software bundled in with lots of other software. Your cut could be pennies. But, it means you can license to others too.

Or someone simply acquires your software lock, stock and barrel.

Just make sure you're not using anyone else's code, or if you are, you ensure you have the rights to use that code, and that that code in turn doesn't use other code etc ad infinitum.

Getting yourself a good lawyer is critical.

cheers
Chris Maunder

honey the codewitch22-Jul-21 3:49

22-Jul-21 3:49

I have a hardware partner, and what's funny is my code will run on $30 off-the-shelf hardware so I don't even need to proto it.

It's got far better battery life than a cell phone and even right now with the above equipment it's still cheaper than the cheapest smartphone. It also has a better screen for reading because e-paper doesn't cause eye strain so much.

There's a market for it, in that there's a market for $100-$150 e-readers so presumably there's one for $30 e-readers with a bit less functionality.

I won't be doing the sales myself. I've got a guy who has been running a successful company since the 1980s, marketing and building products who is willing to run point for me.

All of the code I lifted so far is public domain.

Real programmers use butterflies

Gerry Schmitz22-Jul-21 5:51

Gerry Schmitz

22-Jul-21 5:51

It wouldn't be the first time a better idea didn't go anywhere because it was easier to maintain the status quo (e.g. VHS vs BETA).

You haven't made the (business) case IMO of why or how someone else would use what "sounds" like a "component" and not a product. Maybe it's more of a SKU for the DIY.

It was only in wine that he laid down no limit for himself, but he did not allow himself to be confused by it.
― Confucian Analects: Rules of Confucius about his food

honey the codewitch22-Jul-21 6:23

22-Jul-21 6:23

An e-reader is a product. See also, the kindle and the nook.

They run software on a smartphone-like backend. The software is needed in order to make the epub reader read epubs. The software is an application, not a component.

The existing software requires a machine with at least 256MB of RAM and a processor running at like 1GHz.

Retail cost for a nook or a kindle is like $100-$150 USD

My software also reads epubs. It can do so with $30 worth of off-the-shelf hardware. The hardware is smaller too. You literally buy it, upload the software I wrote. Stick an SD card in it and start reading ebooks.

It requires like maybe 512kB of RAM or less, but more makes it faster. It runs on a 240MHz processor.

$30 is less $100, and certainly less than $150

Furthermore, the battery life of such a device is much longer than the more expensive variety.

So, the business case is this: One can introduce an entirely new line of ereaders for about $30, and the size of a paperback pulp novel, but much thinner.

I thought it was obvious. My bad.

Edit: Also, I *think* these readers lose money, which amazon and B&N make up on the back end by selling ebooks. The reason I think that is the cost of the hardware + screen is more than the device, so even if they got bulk discounts through massive leverage at best they might be breaking even. My device would run on hardware that would be profitable.

Real programmers use butterflies

modified 22-Jul-21 12:30pm.

enhzflep22-Jul-21 15:54

enhzflep

22-Jul-21 15:54

I'd document the way I went about approaching the many problems to be solved, while not actually providing any code. You'd offer the chance to those so inclined to do much of the learning you yourself did and the joy of penning the actual code that does the magic.

AND

I'd sell the code.

I help myself first so that I'm in a position to help those important to me. My late grandmother used to say that 30 years ago. Luv ya gran..

honey the codewitch22-Jul-21 16:18

22-Jul-21 16:18

I'm already doing that in order to provide my salesperson and another very senior engineer/consultant i'm in cahoots with - with ammunition to bring to bear when it comes time to sell the thing.

I need to finish the code though, because there's still a chance that the performance of this thing won't be feasible on an ESP32. The only way to find out is to do it.

If it doesn't work, I may try to find a cheapo last gen ARM Cortex-R or even an A to run it on.

But right now I've researched the market, I've documented what I've found, I've documented what my code potentially does, how it (and the associated hardware) would improve things for the potential purchaser, and where it adds (i think) the most value.

All of that is helping me make better decisions and also helping my little support team make better decisions.

But I don't actually want to document how I did it publicly because I'm going a different direction - I'm releasing all the component pieces needed to do most of the heavy lifting. The final app glues all those together *and* orchestrates it in such a way that it will perform okay (it will never perform *well* on an ESP32). The latter part is where a lot of the work is, so I'm confident that based on timing and complexity I'm safe doing things this way, as long as I DO NOT publicly document how my epub application itself works, technically.

Real programmers use butterflies

enhzflep22-Jul-21 20:16

enhzflep

22-Jul-21 20:16

Good stuff. Jeez I'm inarticulate at times - it seems you're going about it in exactly the manner I'd been thinking - as in, some secret sauce (source?) is in the actual code for the libraries you're developing, but all of the very best stuff is the way you're leveraging them all to make a final product..

It was decades from the initial release of DOOM to the public release of its source, though many very interesting tidbits of food for thought was given out far earlier.

Here's to you improving the nous of many programmers the world over AND your own finances. Beer | [beer]

englebart29-Jul-21 18:34

englebart

29-Jul-21 18:34

I had a few crazy, fresh thoughts as this popped back to top of mind tonight.

Make sure I get my 10 million+ usd if you follow through on this.

2 billionaires are currently fighting to be first to launch global WiFi/ satellite networks.

They might consider an ultra cheap e reader that they can give away for free in third world remote areas if it breaks even through micropayments. Heck, they might be willing to take losses for years just to build the user base. Look at how simple SMS based currency/banking apps have dominated in emerging markets.

Sell/license your stack to one of them. Hopefully, you can instigate a bidding war.

One billionaire would LOVE to rollout the kindle killer.
The other might buy you out just to save the kindle.

Since there is no browser, figure out how to leverage the ePub to turn it into THE browser. A book is just a single tome version of a website. A SaaS adapter could be written to present websites as books.

honey the codewitch29-Jul-21 19:10

29-Jul-21 19:10

I'm taking a lot of liberties with HTML and CSS - as in not supporting most of it - in order to do this.

I'm not sure it could function as a regular browser. Maybe as you say, with an adapter but as it is, it's just not capable enough. For starters, the screen doesn't refresh very well which makes input less than great. It's fine once in awhile but using the web requires a lot of typing. That's part of the issue. The other issue is there's no way this thing runs javascript unless that's literally all it's doing, and maybe not even then. There's absolutely no way I can keep an in memory DOM on this thing, even with 4MB of PSRAM that would put a damper on things.

Real programmers use butterflies

englebart30-Jul-21 4:36

englebart

30-Jul-21 4:36

Agreed. Focus first on the e reader.

If you can create hyperlinks between 2 e books with a single level “back” stack, that would suffice for a lot of use cases. I suspect that should be part of the e book specs.

Don’t even try to build web/html/css/JavaScript.

honey the codewitch30-Jul-21 4:42

30-Jul-21 4:42

Yeah, I mean I do have to support those technologies (HTML/CSS/XML) to a degree but I'm trying to see what I can get away with leaving out.

Real programmers use butterflies

Thought of the Day

OriginalGriff21-Jul-21 4:56

OriginalGriff

21-Jul-21 4:56

Why do we call goods sent by ship cargo, and something sent by car a shipment?

"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
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DerekT-P21-Jul-21 5:02

DerekT-P

21-Jul-21 5:02

[sigh]. I'd have thought it was quite plain, Griff.

Daniel Pfeffer21-Jul-21 5:08

Daniel Pfeffer

21-Jul-21 5:08

Neither word carries the full freight.

Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.

jeron121-Jul-21 5:22

jeron1

21-Jul-21 5:22

I was lading for that one.

"the debugger doesn't tell me anything because this code compiles just fine" - random QA comment
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DRHuff21-Jul-21 5:31

DRHuff

21-Jul-21 5:31

Sorry Griff but this one just didn’t deliver.
Cargo jokes are gross. You should tare this one up!

If you can't laugh at yourself - ask me and I will do it for you.

David Crow21-Jul-21 5:42

David Crow

21-Jul-21 5:42

Same reason we park on driveways but drive on parkways, perhaps.

"One man's wage rise is another man's price increase." - Harold Wilson

"Fireproof doesn't mean the fire will never come. It means when the fire comes that you will be able to withstand it." - Michael Simmons

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PIEBALDconsult21-Jul-21 7:52

PIEBALDconsult

21-Jul-21 7:52

Wow, I see that one going all the way back to 2003. Cool | :cool: