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I was myself a big believer of the Microsoft up-down (one version good - one bad), but 8.1 somehow broke me, but maybe it's not a new version after all and I only have to wait...
I'm not questioning your powers of observation; I'm merely remarking upon the paradox of asking a masked man who he is. (V)
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OriginalGriff wrote: evangelists here who would like to believe otherwise...
I believe that Win 8.1 is reasonably good.
I don't consider myself being an evangelist, but as far as I can recall there was more than a 1 year timeframe between Vista and 7.
Apart from that I navigate through most of the menus with the keyboard ([Win]+[E] to get to the Explorer, [Win]+[L] to lock the computer) and therefore I am not limited in doing what I need to.
The only big improvement I can see (and which is still my dream) that you could move the App-Windows around like normal Windows, on a full-screen "Desktop" (which possibliy could be a user-chosen image). Apart from that I am satisfied with the full-screen start menu home.
Clean-up crew needed, grammar spill... - Nagy Vilmos
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I spent several hours yesterday installing Windows 8.1 and drivers, setting up every setting I found...
only to have it do a BSOD on me, run System Restore without letting me pick the restore point, and promptly undo every single application I installed and every setting I changed. 
I think it was the wireless driver which came with the wireless card, must've not been compatible. 
Windows 8.1 experience: kill it with fire.
Although I did find the desktop app. Now I just need to find a hacky program to restore the Start menu so I don't get what I'm typing blocked out by a full-screen search box. 
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SortaCore wrote: I think it was the wireless driver which came with the wireless card, must've not been compatible.
Not really MS fault if you install a non-compatible driver, isn't it?
SortaCore wrote: only to have it do a BSOD on me, run System Restore without letting me pick the restore point, and promptly undo every single application I installed and every setting I changed.
Backup. You need a backup.
SortaCore wrote: Although I did find the desktop app. Now I just need to find a hacky program to restore the Start menu so I don't get what I'm typing blocked out by a full-screen search box.
I still don't get why this bothers people. The behavior stays the same, it is only displayed in a different way?
Clean-up crew needed, grammar spill... - Nagy Vilmos
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Marco Bertschi wrote: Not really MS fault if you install a non-compatible driver, isn't it?
It is MS' fault, because I doubt the motherboard distributor (being the motherboard targets Windows 7+ only) would write a driver that's not compatible. So MS made something incompatible between 7 and 8.1.
Less likely, the driver installer didn't detect an incompatible OS, so was coded in a faulty manner. But MS' fancy Windows 8.1 should really have a bit of a more sophisticated response than a BSOD, and should detect invalid drivers on install. I'm not blaming MS for having a fault, just for handling it in an awful way.
Marco Bertschi wrote: Backup. You need a backup.
No one creates a backup mid-way through an computer setup. Before and after, yes, but not half-way through it, since you'll lose your place amongst the long list of installs.
And I don't see why it reset my Control Panel-based settings when it clearly told me no settings would be deleted - I thought it would use the good driver config like Windows XP's Last Known Good Configuration idea, not freak out and wipe everything.
Marco Bertschi wrote: still don't get why this bothers people. The behavior stays the same, it is only displayed in a different way?
The display forces a physical disconnection from what you were looking at, and if you were just about to type something, it's disorientating. It's like you looking at a screen and when you press a key someone slams a opaque plastic screen in the way, so you can only see a tiny part of it.
When you're focused on your work having it separated from you like that throws you off. Not to mention half the time you're looking at what you're searching for (i.e. code) and typing something related, so it doesn't help to not be able to see it.
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SortaCore wrote: Now I just need to find a hacky program to restore the Start menu
ClassicShell[^] does it for me on my W8 ultrabook. I'm not gonna touch 8.1 with a 10 foot pole, for various reasons. And if W8 updates keep resetting my power and energy settings like they did in the past, I'm gonna kill W8 entirely! 
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Yep - I'm using Classic Shell for the start menu, AutoHotkey script for "backspace means up, not previous view" in Explorer, and UXTheme so I can have a dark theme with light text.
And I installed Start++ so I can use run programs with elevated priviledges, so instead of "regedit", I do "sudo regedit".
Unfortunately there doesn't appear to be a way to scrap the ribbon interface and go back to menus in Windows File Explorer, though, and I hate oversized GUIs.
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Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter wrote: you excepted something else?
I suspect you meant “you expected...”?
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The alternative would be that he meant "accepted" - well, in the context of W8/W8.1? Nah, not likely! I guess you have it right. 
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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When 8.1 was released
Microsoft announced that it will be doing continuous roll outs from now on.
Windows 9 is the end goal of windows 8 - it will not have the desktop that everyone is in love with.
So if you want to be part of the future.
I suggest you start learning windows 8.
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Four legs good.
Two legs better.
It's the future.
Of course, I switched to Linux at home five years ago, and now laugh a lot more at Windows. Although I keep a tame metal machine for homework on days away from the office.
As this was going to be obsolete in April(XP) I installed a 7 image on the old box, found that it works okay, and bought a salvaged license from Germany on Amazon.
It took so long to arrive(I thought) that I bought 8.1 for a bigger box pro-temp. It installed easily, ran nicely and was defo a bit phreaky. The apps from the disk broke down straight away, but with a forced update 20 of them were replaced(why not auto?) and work now.
Still I haven't used it since. I'm going to sysprep the box and sell it as a going concern.
Windows 7 license? Turned out the courier put the Amazon box in my garage. On top of a pile of opened Amazon boxes.
But I found it so all is well. 
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This is how I install windows 8
...
I put in the disc and walk away.
no unattended install.
no sysprep.
If you put any thought into a windows 8 install - you are doing it wrong
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Yeah. No sysprep. Great if you want to give some random bozo access to your accounts and identity after you sell the computer.
Now WTF didn't I think of that? 
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What's that mate? Format \u? Is that normally how you thank people? If microsoft depends on Dinosaurs, it'll be gone in ten years.
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I am not Microsoft.
Although if I were to sell a computer format /u is the only way to remove personal information from a hard drive as it writes the byte F9 several times to remove the possibility of data stolen.
As for Microsoft's plan is to find the all use case so you don't need to setup anything.
If I have to care about the Operating system on a single machine or any machine for that matter - I have already lost.
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Colborne_Greg wrote: Windows 9 is the end goal of windows 8 - it will not have the desktop that
everyone is in love with
Sorry, but that's just nonsense. Never gonna happen. Perhaps in the RT version - and even that sounds very unlikely to me.
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sorry that is what is happening - as I am told by the instructors thought the Microsoft academy.
Deal with it
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"Deal with it"
Suicide call of Kame Kaze business through the ages.
And Ford still only makes black cars. 
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If people dealt with ford only making black cars
those cars would still be made in Detroit
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If Windows 9 doesn't have the desktop at all, not even salvageable by the likes of Classic Shell, then it will be something that everyone hates and it will encourage a lot of people to move to Linux distros, which are much more full-featured and user friendly these days. Look at the low takeup of Windows 8 – 9 would be far worse than that.
If Microsoft wants to be part of the future, they'll do well to listen to what their customers want.
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Says you.
windows phone 8 was at %0.8 market share is now over %4
by the time 9 arrives in 8 years from now
8.1 - 2013
8.2 - 2014
8.3 - 2015 and so on
The desktop is a hard to understand technology and everyone that isn't a tech hates it.
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Colborne_Greg wrote: it will not have the desktop that everyone is in love with.
I'm not in love with the desktop, it's just that it's where 99% percent of the Windows applications are run, and with that in mind, if they simply disappear the Desktop I think that other OSes will have a chance (and I don't refer to Linux).
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Yeah that is the problem - nothing or close to nothing is programmed for metro mode.
Though all of our problems in computers in because of how bad the desktop programs are, at least this beast of an operating system called windows 8 a hybrid to bridge the cap for that lack of programming.
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and what makes it funnier is that the Win8 and Win8.1 % is raised just because they stop "selling" Win7 and forced new PCs to come with Win8, so at leas 50% of that user are using it because they were forced and not because they want it! hahahaha
But just a little defense to Win8, Win8 is not as bad as Vista was, the only problem with Win8 is that stupid Metro (and those annoying menus a the border) when you are in a Desktop mode (you must install Start8 you will love it) the OS works the same as Win7 (so no need to change from Win7 hehehehe)
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