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You get what you pay for. A cheap PC with no cooling and a tiny motherboard, which will make impossible to install any good sound card or video card. No cooling means overheating and life-span of a couple of years or so. All you can do is upgrade your hard drive, probably only one and add some memory.
Some people use their PCs to browse the internet and to send e-mail. If that is what you need, go ahead.
When I buy a PC I go to a custom PC builder web site and select some quality components in a big box with water cooling. Like this per example:
SABRE GTX - 4K Star Citizen Battle Station
And then stick with it for 5+ years gradually upgrading components as needed.
throughout my life, my two greatest assets have been mental stability and being, like, really smart.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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They have a fan.
They have USB 3 ports. You can run as many external hard drives as you wish.
Who still installs separate sound cards?
The built-in Intel video chipset is more than sufficient for a lot of applications. But gaming machines, they are not.
You clearly are not drawing a fair comparison. Different purposes.
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The Intel NUC machines are the Microsoft/Intel response to the popularity of the android smart TV media boxes.
None of the ones I have seen have a fan, so it's a niche media center/smartTV streaming PC.
Some people are happy with what is on the mother board, some are not.
And I do install ASUS sound cards on my PCs, there IS a difference if paired with quality headphones.
throughout my life, my two greatest assets have been mental stability and being, like, really smart.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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Sounds like you're thinking of the Intel Compute Stick. That competes directly with the Android TV boxes, and yes, with - what, 2GB of RAM? are rather unappealing to me.
Maybe the Celeron-based NUCs don't have CPU fans, but the i3/i5/i7 ones, AFAIK, all do as they, after all, are the same mobile CPUs used in laptops.
[Edit]
Not to detract the conversion, but:
I have a neighbor who calls himself an audiophile (the type who's spent tens of thousands in receivers and amps). Personally, I'm at a loss to suggest a soundcard to him - beyond what's build into motherboards these days. ASUS isn't exactly known as a high-end audio hardware maker. While I have little doubt it's better than onboard audio, I have to ask - have you ever looked at what else is out there?
modified 31-Jan-18 11:44am.
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Alright I don't want to drive this too far but here:
Intel® NUC Ecosystem Enabling Specification
Virtually all of them state Cooling: Passive (fanless) with very few exceptions.
throughout my life, my two greatest assets have been mental stability and being, like, really smart.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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"Provides the technical specifications for the Intel® NUC ecosystem, including specs for tested hardware, design-ready and design-in-progress chassis, and peripherals"
So, it's a spec, probably for OEMs, but it seems to me like the ones they sell themselves tend to include a fan regardless.
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dandy72 wrote: I have a neighbor who calls himself an audiophile (the type who's spent tens of thousands in receivers and amps). Personally, I'm at a loss to suggest a soundcard to him - beyond what's build into motherboards these days. ASUS isn't exactly known as a high-end audio hardware maker. While I have little doubt it's better than onboard audio, I have to ask - have you ever looked at what else is out there?
OK, going totally off-topic here. Don't bother with a soundcard, there are plenty of really high quality USB DACs out there that will blow an audiophile's socks off. Personally I like FiiO and have their Olympus 2-E10K. It has headphone, line and digital coax outputs.
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Yes, FiiO makes good stuff. Bought the X5, very happy.
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You do know that you can build your own PC with superior specs for a little more than half the price than the one in your link and it can be done in less than two hours right? The markup on those machines is unbelievable.
if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); }
Meus ratio ex fortis machina. Simplicitatis de formae ac munus. -Foothill, 2016
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Price is in canadian pessos, not sure if you considered that.
Edit:
$2,384.00 US vs
$3,125.33 CAD for that particular PC
I actually did once a calculation based on prices from newegg, including delivery for each component and the markup was around 100-200 dollars with one year warranty.
throughout my life, my two greatest assets have been mental stability and being, like, really smart.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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Not including the video card since coin miners have driven up the prices to absurd levels, you can still get a better rig for that price.
My latest build:
Case - $130: Thermaltake Core V71 Full Tower
CPU - $330: Intel Core i7-7740X
MoBo - $350: ASUS ROG STRIX x299-E
RAM - $181: G.Skill Ripjaws 16GB (2x8GB)
SDD - $204: Intel SSD 600p M.2 512GB SSD fast as hell, BTW, Win 10 boots in seconds
Total - $1195 w/free shipping
I salvaged a EVGA GeForce 970 and several SSD's and spinning disks from the old rig so that helped. The 1070's now are running like $950 so that drives the price up for new.
if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); }
Meus ratio ex fortis machina. Simplicitatis de formae ac munus. -Foothill, 2016
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For the record the list you provide is NOT the PC I have linked. Not by a long shot.
Only the ASUS ROG GeForce GTX 1070 STRIX is $754.99 ok?
here some of the actual components:
Intel 7th Gen Core i7-7700K Desktop Processor (BX80677I77700K)
by Intel
CDN$ 398.00
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero $340.99
IN WIN 805 BLACK Black Aluminum $225.99
ASUS ROG GeForce GTX 1070 STRIX $754.99
If we add the rest, it will be pretty close to what they charge.
Anyway, every 5 years or so I order a completely new PC and I kinda prefer the assembly to be done by a pro
throughout my life, my two greatest assets have been mental stability and being, like, really smart.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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Stable Genius wrote: For the record the list you provide is NOT the PC I have linked. Not by a long shot.
Um, not to get nit-picky here but it exceeds the PC you linked by a margin.
| Component | Linked PC | My PC | Winner |
|---|
| CPU | i7-7700 LGA 1151 4.2GHz (5GHz overclock) | i7-7740X LGA 2066 4.3GHz (5.2GHz overclock) | My PC (just barely) | | Motherboard | Asus ROG Maximus IX Hero | Asus ROG STRIX X299-E | My PC with 128 Max RAM and more PCI Express slots and the option to use a i7-7820X | | Case | Complete toss-up here. Cases are more a personal preference **but mine is bigger  **. | |
| RAM | HyperX FURY DDR4 x16GB CAS Lat: 16 | G.SKILL Ripjaws V DDR4 x16GB CAS Lat: 15 | My PC just eeks a win here | | SSD | Kingston UV400 480GB SATA 3 (90K IOPS/Read;35K IOPS/Write) | Intel 600p M.2 512GB (128.5K IOPS/Read;128K IOPS/Write) | My PC smokes your PC in this area with 1.7GBps sequential read vs 550MBps |
As you can see, the PC that I built by hand is on par with the PC you linked in most ares and exceeds it in other areas. All for a lower price. Does the PC you linked have more flash and pizazz then mine? Yes.
if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); }
Meus ratio ex fortis machina. Simplicitatis de formae ac munus. -Foothill, 2016
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Stable Genius wrote: No cooling means overheating and life-span of a couple of years or so. All you can do is upgrade your hard drive, probably only one and add some memory.
I just bought myself a couple of Minix Neo Z83-4 (no relationships to the Minix OS): The Atom-based CPU draws 2 watts of power. I am not afraid of overheating! The specifications say that the system peak power requirement is below 1A @ 12V (i.e. less than 12 W peak); the only reason why it is delivered with a 3A power supply is for the 4 USB ports to supply power to external devices.
I did not buy these to replace a desktop system, but as hubs for a number of Arduiono to offload their collected data and to receive new orders. I wanted the network to be able to handle power blackouts, e.g. by going into a low-power mode in a controlled manner. So the hubs must be able to run on the power from a 12V accumulator for some time, preferably without draining it.
According to the specs this tiny little box can e.g. display 4K video while running cabled and/or wireless LAN, Buletooth, manage four USB ports,... Maybe it would get a little warm if you run all the subsystems 24/7 at maximum performance. For my use, the machines would be idling at least 90% of the time. I am hunting sparrows, I am not in a battle. I need no cannon to do the job.
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It's a nice toy but overpriced (big time) for the features you have...
Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
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I usually buy components and build my own, but I'm getting older
and lazier! I appreciate the comments...I had doubts about cooling
and pricing. Only thing that appealed to me was size.
73
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I ![Heart | [heart]](https://www.codeproject.com/script/Forums/Images/love.gif) my Gigabit Brix!
8 thread i7, 16GB RAM, 500GB fast write Samsung SSD, HDMI + DisplayPort video outputs, digital audio and 4 USB3 ports. A lot of goodness in a 4" x 4" x 2" package. Runs VS2015 blazingly fast and is deathly quiet. It's so small you can take it with you in your carry-on luggage when you travel by air. All you need is a keyboard, mouse and monitor.
/ravi
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Wow, I'm guessing the naysayers who have responded so far have NOT used a NUC, or they simply didn't know what to expect or make of it. They certainly have their uses. There's Celeron-based NUCs that can be had for USD$125, but clearly - you can't build any sort of good machine around that, regardless of form factor.
I practically spend my entire time working off of virtual machines (running on a physical host in another room, at the office 70 kms away, or on Azure), so the machine I have on my desk doesn't matter all that much. What matters to me is that I have something that's quiet, isn't a huge power draw, and doesn't generate a ton of heat. That rules out a lot of standard machines. My VM host has loud fans and is quite the heat source (bad in the summer), so I didn't want it in my home office. That machine is tucked away in another room so I don't see or hear it, and I remote into it from the NUC on my desk.
I bought my first NUC (NUC5i5MYBE) almost 3 years ago when I first learned they could drive 4K monitors. So I have a 40" 4K TV as my main display running off of it, plus a 24" 1920x1200 monitor and a 27" 1920x1080 (both running off of VGA to USB 3 adapters). It boots up ridiculously fast. With an SSD and 16GB RAM, nearly everything I do locally gets an immediate response. This is fast enough to run three 1080p videos on all 3 monitors at the same time without ever dropping a single frame. It's no gaming machine, but that's not what I got it for. I've certainly used much slower laptops - it's an i5, 2.3 GHz, and 4 logical CPUs (2 cores + hyperthreading) so it's really no slouch.
Since then I've purchased a second one (NUC7i5BNH) as that newer generation can handle 32GB of RAM, and my main VM host (with 64GB) was getting bogged down, and I had a need to start creating a bunch of Linux VMs. And I didn't want another loud, power-hungry beast running 24/7.
While I don't run VS itself on it, given that some people are okay coding on old(ish) laptops, I could certainly see someone doing that on a NUC. And, they support virtualization, so even one with "merely" 16GB of RAM will do if you don't need a bunch of heavyweight VMs.
YMMV, but please - nobody will convince me there's no place for them.
modified 31-Jan-18 11:09am.
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I have a 1 year old Core i5 NUC with 16Gb RAM / 1 TB SSD running Windows 10 Pro. For the first 6-8 months it hung intermittently (1 in 5 times) upon boot or very soon after. If it made it through the first few minutes it was solid for as long as it remained on. Very frustrating. After a bunch of Intel driver updates a few months back it's MUCH better.
I don't want to curse it by saying it's totally fixed. Let's just say I'm cautiously optimistic.
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Never had as much of a stutter on either of mine except for music streaming off of my LAN, but that turned out to be a player problem.
As you wrote, driver updates might help - but have you also looked at upgrading the BIOS? Intel seems to do a better job of regularly providing BIOS updates than most motherboard manufacturers.
That said, avoid the very recent Spectre/Meltdown updates. In this particular case, Intel's actually rolled back one of them (but then, that's not a problem specific to NUCs).
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I was probably too vague in my post. I've done every BIOS update that's come along (not including the most recent Spectre/Meltdown ones). So it could have been one of them that has improved things.
BTW - What's the problem with the current Intel Spectre/Meltdown updates?
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Mike Mullikin wrote: BTW - What's the problem with the current Intel Spectre/Meltdown updates?
Oh, boy, where do I start? Have you been hiding under a rock?
Intel's pretty much taken down every single BIOS updates they've published so far because of "random freezes" and "more frequent unexpected reboots". Running joke is that "more frequent than 0" is indeed a very bad thing.
I just happen to have installed one of the updates that has been taken down, but I haven't seen a single problem so far...so unless the situation changes, I'm not going to roll it back.
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dandy72 wrote: Have you been hiding under a rock?
A little.
My NUC is in my basement... which is being remodeled... so I haven't done much of anything with it in a few weeks and probably won't for another few weeks.
Good timing I guess.
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The loud heat generators are those that belong in the basement. A NUC is what you keep on your desk.
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