|
IMHO - to learn programming you need no computer at all. When I learned we got books to read, teachers to hear and questions/answers were delivered on paper...
I'm not questioning your powers of observation; I'm merely remarking upon the paradox of asking a masked man who he is. (V)
|
|
|
|
|
I'd vote for IDE as well... but while learning, also learn what it is the IDE is doing for you so that you're not stuck on things simply because the IDE has a bug or you don't know what it is the IDE does in the background.
|
|
|
|
|
IDE without a doubt. But keep that text editor handy to go and have a snoop around in any generated files (e.g. config files) ... compare what you're seeing in the IDE with what you're seeing in the text file - best of both worlds
|
|
|
|
|
|
"Depends"
#include <shamelessgeneralizations.h>
Depends how you learn.
An IDE can help you along by getting you up and running faster. So if you're going to get discouraged by not having results quick, then I'd say use an IDE that will help you along and get you to a project that will run quickly. Then tinker with it from there.
The problem a lot of IDEs have is that they frequently put boilerplate code in for you. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it's bad as it may give you a false sense of what's really required and what is really going on.
A text editor on the other hand demands you really "start from scratch." You have to navigate configuration of the tool chain (compilers, linkers, library paths, build options, etc.) BUT you get the satisfaction of knowing that if you didn't write it, it ain't in there.
Personally I'd much rather WORK with a text editor (I've no doubt my .emacs file is older than most people here.) But for learning a new language or platform, I like starting in an IDE with samples, then tinkering my way to enough knowledge to dispense with them entirely.
|
|
|
|
|
IDE. Except that then you have to learn two things.
I learned with a text editor and I still prefer that for writing actual code -- but not when a drag-and-drop designer is required. And IDEs tend to have a debugger as well.
Back in college everyone (even me) preferred to use Turbo Pascal's IDE (on a 386 PC clone) rather than use VAX Pascal with a VT100.
However you shouldn't get to point where you don't think you could possibly write a simple console app in a text editor and compile it on the command line.
Learn it with an IDE by all means, but come play on the fun side once in a while.
This space intentionally left blank.
|
|
|
|
|
The IDE will mostly help learn the API syntax, but not the language itself.
I'd rather be phishing!
|
|
|
|
|
IDE helps to save the time and brings you all at your perusal. However for a beginner, i wont recommend IDE.
|
|
|
|
|
For HTML, still I prefer Notepad. Hand coding!
thatrajaCode converters | Education Needed
No thanks, I am all stocked up. - Luc Pattyn
When you're wrestling a gorilla, you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is - Henry Minute
|
|
|
|
|
IDE will maybe help you along the way but will also make your life difficult along the way. It does a lot of things for you, and it is good to know those things it does. With a text editor, you have to do those things yourself, thus you learn more. IDEs is not supported by all platforms so if the day arrives that you have to develop on a platform which doesn't support an IDE you'll be struggling coz you've been using a IDE.
Personally if I was you, I'd start off using text editor and later move to IDE. You get some kick ass text editors these days which can do exactly what IDEs can do.
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence."
<< please vote!! >>
|
|
|
|
|
|
If the IDE has an integrated debugger then I suggest using it, is so educational to watch how the code runs, how stuf works and ofcourse is easy to find your bugs.
simion314
|
|
|
|
|
IDE for sure, but once you have the basics of the language, allocate some time to learn what the IDE has been doing for you.
If its been creating stubs/boilerplate stuff, then check those find out what they're doing, and why.
Also be familiar with the structure of any project files or solution files, they aren't the language but you'll likely need to change them at some point.
Taking an app that builds in the IDE and then build it yourself via the command-line tools is a good idea.
Finally learn what else the IDE can do, can it help build unit tests?, help during the design? etc
|
|
|
|
|
IDE.
"Real men drive manual transmission" - Rajesh.
|
|
|
|
|
The IDE solves many problems but IDE-bloat makes it tricky to master. When I search for text, I use my standalone editor, UltraEdit. Its search facilities are better then VS and I can see contexts which are much nicer to navigate than with the IDE. In short, don't be shy to use things that complement the IDE. You sometimes need more than a hammer and chisel in your toolbox.
If there is one thing more dangerous than getting between a bear and her cubs it's getting between my wife and her chocolate.
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks all for your comments, seems I'll be playing with both then!
|
|
|
|
|
Honestly, it depends on the IDE and your environment.
I would say multiple monitors is more important that an IDE, but having BOTH is better.
Also, I recommend the PAINFULLY obvious... Please spend a LOT of time READING code. You would not expect someone to be a good author who had never read a book, would you? So, the more code you read, the more you will start to pick up, and leverage later on.
There is nothing wrong with a Good IDE. But if the IDE is constantly saying "Please wait while we do some background work", and it slows you down... Then it might be frustrating/painful. On the other hand, if it is responsive, and works, and has easy access to help, etc. I think it is a great way to learn.
And I have punched cards, and worked with TECO (optimized for Paper Terminal Editing, on a PDP/11). I use NotePad++ for a lot, but I use a couple of IDEs where they make sense. Syntax highlighting can significantly help with learning a language, and specifically reading source code...
Best of luck....
|
|
|
|
|
Hear hear!
Member 10389821 wrote: I have punched cards
I haven't.
Member 10389821 wrote: and worked with TECO ... on a PDP/11.
Done that. While the other students were using a line-editor (EDT in line mode) the cool kids taught me to use TECO in screen mode.
I was shocked later to find that EDT has a screen mode -- it's what I still use on VMS, I never bothered to learn EVE or LSE.
This space intentionally left blank.
|
|
|
|
|
Either way is fine for learning the language and OO principles.
But part of what you need to learn is how to use an IDE, you need to know how to use the tools for scaffolding, building, debugging, etc. because this is how most software shops do things. So I'd say go ahead and use whatever IDE is appropriate for your language, because you'll need to know how to use it.
|
|
|
|
|
It really depend on how much time you can devote to learn a new language with its libraries. Also how in-depth you want to know the new language or programming paradigm. If you have a project waiting to be developed and you are coming to speed on the language then a IDE will get you there quicker. A good IDE (i.e. Visual Studio) is an memory augmentation as well as a guiding tool. Projects involve not just the language you will have to know but also the mountain of libraries as well. However, if you really want to burn the language construct into memory, using a text editor will do that, because you have to correct any mistakes you've made and we all know we learn best from our mistakes. If you are absolute beginner start to learn to program, text editor might be easier path, but if you are seasoned programmer just stepping into other language and already familiar with how IDE works, then an IDE probably the way to go. Fighting an IDE at the same time while trying to understand a new syntax is a double edges sword.
|
|
|
|
|
Text editor? IDE?, no, you should start by writing your code on paper, then sending it to a professional mainframe operator for him to turn it into punched cards and run it, it may take around 4 weeks to get the results, so better make no mistakes...
Seriously, given that IDEs do a lot of magic being the scenes, i recommend you to start with a text editor (Notepad++ is a good one) and compile by hand, this way you'll have a better grasp of what you're really doing. Don't like the text editor?, then you may want to use an IDE, but start with empty projects and turn off code completition (Intellisense on VS).
|
|
|
|
|
There is two schools in learning.
Top down or down top.
The down top approach means that you start from the abyss, where "abyss" is an arbitrary start point that change depending on the age of the adviser.
For 60 years old guy, you should start with assembler. For the 30 years old guy, most likely C++, and for the 40 years old guy C.
For your specific question, replace the name of the languages with the name of respective text editor/IDE release date.
The Top down approach does not depends on the age of the adviser. You start with the problem, read tutorial that permit you to move quick and deepen your knowledge as you encounter new problems.
I am a big believer in the top down approach that keep your motivation high since you can apply immediately your knowledge.
As a .NET trainer, this is the approach I use for my students, and always got good feedback on that.
So in short : Start with IDE. Except if the place you will work, for one reason or another can't have the IDE. The IDE is not less important than the language.
But I will tell you : If the company you work for is too poor to buy you an IDE, then they probably not selling the right product... or the product right.
An IDE has a so minimal price compared to a salary, that's it is not even worth debatting. Startup ? Use Bizpark.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Good! I hate it when the ice cream starts melting on the way home from the store!
Anything that is unrelated to elephants is irrelephant Anonymous ----- The problem with quotes on the internet is that you can never tell if they're genuine Winston Churchill, 1944 ----- I'd just like a chance to prove that money can't make me happy. Me, all the time
|
|
|
|
|
If only I didn't have to sell both my arms and legs to get one...
|
|
|
|