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I had a bad experience with Codility, and I heard most candidates for this position performed worse than me. Two issues:
* The deadline was too short for completing all the excercises.
* The excercises felt like a mid term or final exam from an undergraduate degree subject, too abstract and low level.
So, grab your school books...
Darío
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The purpose of the programming interview is to find programmers you can work with successfully. The purpose of HR is to get the programmers skills at the lowest possible cost. These objectives are orthogonal and sadly have resulted in the modern version of the white board coding interview, the programmers test.
In my experience good programmers are ones that love programming and solving problems. If they are not working for you they are most likely working on a side project, reading or writing code or something else programming related. With them programming is not a job its something they are. These types of people hate programmer tests. Why?
Because they understand that the test has little or nothing to do with solving their current problem which is, "how do I get a job, preferably one I will like, where I get to do what I love doing."
The best way I have found to hire talented programmers is to sit down and just talk with them about programming. Good programmers will quickly warm to the subject and before you know it you will be talking about solving problems, new constructs, theory, developmental approaches and so on. You might even learn something new! Good programmers love to program and to talk about programming. They just don't like to waste time solving solved problems to which the solutions could be found in seconds with a simple Google search. You will learn more from a simple 10 minute conversation than days and days of these tests.
The argument always comes up in these discussions that we, "Need to filter out" those candidates that don't have the skills. Really? Are you telling me you can't tell within five minutes if the candidate does not have the skills? Is your time so valuable that you can't spare a couple of minutes on the phone to determine this? if so then maybe you should be focusing on that important work that you need to do and leave the hiring to someone else.
Kelly
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Nice assessment. When conducting interviews, I used to spend 10-15 minutes talking to the candidate, then ask them to go to the white board and write a simple function [e.g., reverse a string]. Found a number of great candidates that way. One may love programming but if one cannot converse/discuss a [small] problem then one is likely to fail in a group setting.
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NightPen wrote: Are you telling me you can't tell within five minutes if the candidate does not have the skills?
That's the problem...
we would, but most big companies where the departments are so specialized... the HR has no fvcking clue about technology beyond SmartPhone, Office and maybe a couple of things more. If you are lucky, the HR will be an advanced user, but still no programmer.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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I've done many online coding assessments, mainly with multiple choice answers, and while they are a pretty poor way of assessing a job candidate vs. an original coding exercise, employers and HR love them, and passing them well has got me a few jobs in my +- 15 years .NET experience.
Even now, I've had one brief interview with an HR lady, she is busy vetting my CV, references, and criminal record check, but she told me as soon as that is done, I will do an online assessment, and if I do well, a one year contract is mine. No further interviews or any of the recruitment process crap.
"'Do what thou wilt...' is to bid Stars to shine, Vines to bear grapes, Water to seek its level; man is the only being in Nature that has striven to set himself at odds with himself."
—Aleister Crowley
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Yeah, I did one a few years ago. It totally sucked and was a waste of my time. I was presented with three problems and scored zero because my style is to do things right. I started into two of the three and ran out of time because I have the awful habit of thinking too much (the third problem was never going to fit into the [short] time allotted). Anyway, I write beautiful code and that company missed a good opportunity.
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You're right - you have to write the code the way they want it written.
Codility and other online coding testing sites are proof that they're lazy and don't know how to hire engineers. I've seen many gross mistakes in problems and fail to see what value it really provides outside of stealing money from HR.
Seriously though - I just find a topic or two on their resume and drill down into it. I ask to provide a diagram of the system, go into design issues, problems they ran into, how they were resolved, etc. It's more effective and much harder to fake.
"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music."
-- Marcus Brigstocke, British Comedian
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At one time, the PAT (Programmer Aptitude Test) was simply a variation of some of the IQ tests available then and now; emphasizing abstract thinking and lanuage comprehension.
These IMO were better for showing a candidate's "potential" than their ability to pass a canned test.
I think at one time people were hired for their potential; not past deeds; or that they're cheaper.
But with short-range thinking (and a disposable society), you don't need long-term potential.
"(I) am amazed to see myself here rather than there ... now rather than then".
― Blaise Pascal
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It is such a nuisance to have to stop playing your VVG (violent video game), and actually go outside the house to commit a felony ! Fortunately, you can get free board and care just by using Emojis properly: [^]
«While I complain of being able to see only a shadow of the past, I may be insensitive to reality as it is now, since I'm not at a stage of development where I'm capable of seeing it.» Claude Levi-Strauss (Tristes Tropiques, 1955)
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From news.com.au: Making a criminal threat via emoji. WTF. What's the world coming to? We should be laughing that little dude off the face of the planet. That's not a death threat, that's a little dude who's balls haven't dropped yet.
Jeremy Falcon
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Well, not everybody can craft elegantly eloquent death threats. Kudos to the judge to recognise that, and recognise the intent hidden behind the lack of talent!
modified 7-Dec-17 1:58am.
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I am not a fan of Skype for business.
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ya, $ucks ar$se
If it's not broken, fix it until it is.
Everything makes sense in someone's mind.
Ya can't fix stupid.
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Is anyone? Including people who work on it?
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But it's marginally better than Teams, which we're mandated to use and doesn't even have pop-out windows.
Slack takes a lot of beating...
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pt1401 wrote: Slack takes a lot of beating
Is Slack any good? I have heard of it, but don't know if it is any good.
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For my use, it has the edge on both Teams & SfB.
It has teams (aka Channels) which SfB doesn't.
It has pop-out windows which Teams doesn't (though they're working on adding it to Teams).
It has video & audio calls.
It has adding contacts outside your organisation.
It has conferencing & desktop sharing.
and all the normal messaging stuff.
The only thing I use in SfB that Slack doesn't have is the voice calling to landlines.
Give it a try...
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We have assumed control... We have assumed control...
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No need to apologize for geeking out man, we're the people that change the world while the rest just watch us do it. Geek on!
Jeremy Falcon
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Cheers!
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Is Instagram your grandma on speed dial?
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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You're cousin us to really reach low on this one, and that aunt easy, Kinsidering where we've gone before.
Say, you know where is Moscow? Right next to Pa's cow. (a moooot point).
Ravings en masse^ |
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"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
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W∴ Balboos wrote: Say, you know where is Moscow? Right next to Pa's cow...
In every other part of the world aside from Merka that don't rhyme. There is no cow sound in Moscow. Listen to Russia's 1980 Olympic song, tells you how to pronounce their capital city.
Michael Martin
Australia
"I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible."
- Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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