Your Original Comment implied that getting paid in currency was a pure bonus above just getting in there to read the manuals. Unless I read it wrong.
So I meant if you could sell the concept of Free IT workers, I am buying
As for the phrase "You get what you pay for". If you have not heard that phrase used before I am shocked, but I will explain it briefly.
A Guy walks in and offers to be a lead developer in the US. He has 10 years of programming experience, and he is willing to work for $12.00/hr (50% above minimum wage these days).
Do you think you are getting someone who is WORTH the $30-$50/hr going rate. Or one of the expensive guys who charge $75-$150/hr WORTH of programming and decision making?
I watched this happen. I watched him get hired. I watched the project crash and burn 8 months later, and the whole thing got scrapped. They got what they paid for. [Side Note: I warned the company. Only 1 of the 2 facts about the programmer should be true. He EITHER has 10 years of experience, OR he is willing to work for $12.00/hr... Not both!]
As to the risk of the relationship. More risk on the side of the employer. The employee pretty-well protected. Very easy to sue and win to get paid.
Not getting hired, job seeker hits the pavement and is seen working on his ground game to this day.
Prospective employer hangs on to all the vital statistics he just "managed" to acquire by deceit/non-deceit and laughs in secure lock-down , well pay continues, twenty-stories-over-the-cement viewport cleaned. Was that Geronimo singing "NEXT"?
Oh, "suit"? Yeah. Bad idea showing up for that one with my beaver down.
So on the one hand, I am not paid enough to deal with:
midnight tech support calls from, sigh, the tech support people
the stress induced by a complete lack of testing / QA infrastructure on the part of the company
On the other hand, I also think I'm ridiculously overpaid, if only because, quite frankly, I think teachers should be the highest paid professionals, period, not some shmuck lik me who writes ATM software for casinos where people who shouldn't be spending their money are wasting it, and people who do have gobs of money to waste are, well, wasting it.
On the gripping hand, I've also done some very rewarding work for other industries, and they tend to be non-profit or barely-profitable, so the pay reflects that. And interestingly, I'm a lot happier.
I will disagree that ALL teachers should be paid so well...
First, it is our duty as a society to teach our children to read, and to write, and to love to learn.
They (unionized teachers) no longer teach "how to learn". The teach WHAT to learn.
Because if they teach "HOW" then the kids don't need them so much. You don't learn HOW to learn
until about college these days, and you only learn then because professors are USUALLY so bad at teaching anyways.
While we MUST value education. We currently pay near the TOP for the WORSE education system in 50 years! so I see no value in paying more for it.
Also, we do NOTHING to get the students to realize that they NEED the education. Hence the dropout rates.
My daughter is just starting to realize that she has to work 2 months to make what I can make in less than a day! (Admittedly she is part time, but the OMG was worth it!)
Imagine the hordes of lowlies from China and India, or even Korea (Long hours is considered cool and heroic, like silicon valley but one third the wages) working low wages long hours for their Asian masters?
Problem with Chinaman is, everything is expressed in #hours you work. Doesn't matter if anything is achieved. So long everyone is suffering, like in old kungfu movies.
If you have problem with getting paid too much, try work for Asian masters.
One of the rampant problems everywhere in the world is people treating other people like human beings, not human "resources." We have a lot of growing, as a species, to do, emotionally and psychologically.
I would like more, of course... let see how it goes.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
I was hired, officially, as a "Java Developer". However, after a few weeks I realised that the title is irrelevant. Instead, we're expected to develop in multiple languages. As such, I've developed software in around 5 other programming languages.
I think developers should be paid relative to the complexity and value of the languages they're developing in, and the quality of the software they produce. Had I known I'd be writing a CLR library to bridge an under-documented .NET library with Java using JNI, I may have negotiated a little more money. The only reason I don't kick up a fuss is because the company is generous with progressive pay increases, and this is also my first development job, so I'm accruing experience (which is as much a requirement in industry now as having a degree or qualification.)
I believe the real question for this poll is: are you paid a salary or wage which is relatively close to what you expect your services, experience and time to be worth, compared to what your company believes?
I am still trainee I so yeah i won't get the money i deserve!
But jokes aside.
I have chosen to get into a company that pays good and with a tariff.
So from that side i feel totally comfty with it.
On the other side, this aint a IT company and i am developing stuff for (mostly) internal use, except from my current project i'd say i get paid enough. But currently i am one person that fills positions for a 10 headed dev team.
And i actually don't know if the final (when out of trainee) ~57k € +(~15-30% bonus if you are good) a year are a good payment.
9$/hour for 160 hours/month. The advantage is that I get paid the same regardless of my productivity (which they try to keep as low as possible with idiotic policies) and I do not have to bring work at home or do extra time (it happened very rarely). Still it is very little - even considering that the maximum pay on average isn't much higher... My coworkers with 12 yeras of experience are paid 13$/hour. That's the market in Italy...
It grants me a wage just above the average worker, I get 1300 €/month instead of the average 900-1000. It's just enough to maintain two people, having found an EXTREMELY convenient rent (about half the average with a bigger house... plain luck) and having already a car (which is a 17 years old econonmy car) and have 200 € / month left.
W∴ Balboos wrote:
Say - you're in the Euro Zone - why not migrate to where they'll pay you enough to live on?
Easier said than done, EU countries are starting to blockade the influx of Italian technicians because we accept lower salaries than our counterparts. It's fairly tough to find jobs in other countries, and I'm not fond of the idea of moving before having found a job, like many people of my age - I saw many of them returning home with nothing there and nothing here.
When my girlfriend will graduate and hopefully find a job we'll breath much better. Anyway mine is the kind of lucky situation in Italy, at least I am hired (will be on January 7th) and not contract working for 3 month a time - which requires opening an individual company and costs roughly 60% of the revenues in taxes.
Plenty of jobs in UK and Ireland in IT, unless your english is very bad you wouldn't have a problem finding a job in these countries.
I live in Dublin and I can ensure you that it's easy for a software developer to find a job here, there is a big lack of software developers. Local recruitment agencies are even organising events in other countries such as Portugal, Spain, Italy etc trying to attract talented professionals.
When I make comparison within my surroundings and circumstances my nominal salary is average and should be enough, but when I add unpaid overtimes, consulting after hours and occasional emotional drainage I feel I am underpaid.
When I make comparison with average salaries for my position in developed (Western) countries, conclusion is that I work for peanuts.
Mislim, dakle jeo sam.
Last Visit: 31-Dec-99 19:00 Last Update: 3-Dec-21 18:40