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Rage against the Office. Let the hate flow through you. I can feel your anger. It makes you stronger, gives you focus.
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You're not my father.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE!
#SupportHeForShe
Government can give you nothing but what it takes from somebody else. A government big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take everything you've got, including your freedom.-Ezra Taft Benson
You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun
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I don't think that that word means what you think it means.
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Have some iocane powder handy?
#SupportHeForShe
Government can give you nothing but what it takes from somebody else. A government big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take everything you've got, including your freedom.-Ezra Taft Benson
You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun
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So many references in one post ... 
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Remember when you were a kid and you just wanted to learn to program some simple games?
Here's a really interesting book I'm dipping into that captures that idea:
Roguelike Development with JavaScript: Build and Publish Roguelike Genre Games with JavaScript and Phaser 1, Andre Alves Garzia, eBook - Amazon.com[^]
It's an APress book and because I'm an unlimited member (download content of all books for the year[^]) I can download it and check it out.
I didn't really know what a roguelike is so I like how nicely the author defines what a Roguelike is (screen shot of old roguelike on IBM PC[^]):
Quote: High-value factors in roguelikes according to The Berlin Interpretation
Random generation - The world is randomly generated so that each game is unique.
Permadeath - Dying in the game causes it to start over from the beginning.
Turn based - The game reacts after the user input. The player can wait and plan their move without fear that things are happening behind their back.
Grid based - The game is represented in a grid; both the players and all the other game entities (such as enemies) are placed on this grid.
Nonmodal - All the actions that are possible in the game are possible on the same screen. There is no need to switch to different modes of play.
Complexity - The game is complex and flexible enough to allow multiple solutions for the challenges presented during gameplay.
Resource management - In-game resources are limited, and managing them is part of the fun.
Hack‘n’slash - Killing lots of enemies is part of the game.
Exploration and discovery - The game requires the player to explore through different levels and discover mysterious objects and entities and their interplay.
Low-value factors in roguelikes according to The Berlin Interpretation
Single player character - The game is focused on the player controlling a single character throughout the gameplay.
Enemies and players are similar - The mechanisms and features that apply to players also apply to enemies.
Tactical challenge - It is crucial to learn tactics to complete the game. Due to the procedural generation, you can’t simply memorize how to win.
ASCII display - It is customary for roguelikes to use ASCII to build its interface.
Dungeons - Most roguelikes are dungeon based with multiple levels, mazes, and rooms.
Numbers - The values used to represent character characteristics and traits are deliberately shown.
Programming can be fun again. 
modified 20-Oct-20 11:14am.
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This is really cool ,thanks ! 
The linked game looks like a game which was delivered with the Amstrad CPC 6128 : https://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=2591[^].
Back to the time when you had to type the code of the game before being able to play - books/magazines with floppy were still not a thing.
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Rage wrote: Back to the time when you had to type the code of the game before being able to play - books/magazines with floppy were still not a thing.
Yes, exactly! It was a great time really.
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Back to the time when you had to type the code of the game before being able to play - books/magazines with floppy were still not a thing.
yup, and when you looked up close in all those one letter variables in somebody else's code they started to make sense.
like in a child's song: B is for base, C is for count, D is for data...
i've got nausea from names that have: Manager, Controller, Delegate, Container, Interface... and will get it in the near future from names containing: Function, Transform, Process, Calculate...
making games is probably the only type of software that doesn't get boring thanks to enemy AI.
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I discovered ROGUE on a MassComp UNIX box (MC Rogue - there were many flavors) in the late 1970's and it is the actual for real genuine inspiration for my buying my first computer. And my first software purchase (DOS came w/PC) was Epyx Rogue. It took me five years to finally win.
I had a rather long tome about the advances in the versions (Descedent) I now play:
Stone Soup's Dungeon Crawl 25.1[^] - this is the google search as there's so many entry points into how you'd start to see where it's gone.
You can chose to be one of 26 species, with one of 27 vocations and, if not assigned by either of the first two choices, one of 25 gods to worship (and their pros and cons). The last of these is only done if you can find the appropriate altar to that god.
Beware of spoilers, but if you wanted a descent description of the current status, there's the Crawl Wiki.[^] I play on my local machine (download) but it can also be played through your browser.
One tends to prefer a character with their own hopes, dreams and aspirations: thus, I am a Demon Spawn Berserker who follows Trog. Every choice, even when you start the game, has consequences. Amazingly diverting . . . and relaxing.
| Ravings en masse^ |
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| "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
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Great and interesting post.
W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: It took me five years to finally win.
That's amazing that you kept at it. 
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All events, locations of things of any type, etc., are always randomized. During that five years there was a trap I stepped on that I came across only once in all of that time (towards the end).
Thing about these - perhaps - is that they're for a generation of people who needed a bit more imagination because special effects were far less developed. You played a lot in what I think is still referred to as "your mind's eye". Even that expression - somewhat poetical an image drawn with words has been replaced by the much more 'flashy' rap. Games - ever closer to live (which is kinda neat) but ultimately a down side even to that: as phones have taken over so much of the social interactions of "the young", their gaming world can fill in their need for that personal interaction they now seem to dread when, well, in person.
So I admit - I use the tiled version - but also, in no small part, because the number of items and creatures to be recognized has grown so much. However, I am still adapting away from the mouse and more to the keyboard (no small feat) as it puts you more into the whole thing as muscle memory puts you more as one with the adventure.
| Ravings en masse^ |
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| "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
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W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: During that five years there was a trap I stepped on that I came across only once in all of that time (towards the end).
That must've hurt since it restarted everything. Maybe you were able to create Save Points along the way?
W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: Thing about these - perhaps - is that they're for a generation of people who needed a bit more imagination because special effects were far less developed. You played a lot in what I think is still referred to as "your mind's eye"
Yeah, in the past it took a bit more imagination to play games and we became accustomed to filling in the missing parts with our imaginations. Now games are so far the other way there are times when they are only pure muscle impulse reaction with little thinking.
The best games are a mix of old school and new graphics, but most game teams don't do that too well. It's a difficult challenge.
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raddevus wrote: That must've hurt since it restarted everything. Maybe you were able to create Save Points along the way?
Actually, no. I got a message that I stepped onto the trap but that was it. Whatever it did I didn't figure out. Just a message.
Now keep the following in mind (about ROGUE): a given item, such as a scroll, may give you different results when you read it. An example (sorry, a tiny spoiler): there's a scroll that if you read it and there's any food on the level it is lit up and you can go after it - but if there's no food, the same scroll will instead give a message "you feel a gnawing in the pit of your stomach". There are others that are, in fact, quite complex in their relationship. One has the ability to 'name' an object, such as a scroll, so you'd name it for the message - and then, if you get a scroll of "identify" and can spare it then you can identify the scroll and finally make the connection. The game's a learning experience. That's the fascination. Drinking potions, at certain times, is more advantageous than at others - but the necessity can interfere with that.
So it is with traps. Usually more definitive - like a poison dart trap or teleport or travel-paralysis for an unspecified period (whilst evil beasties might beat on you - and you can fight but can't run). When is is wise to fight in a corridor (possibly by running away) instead of standing one's ground?
Anyway - after over forty years and various forks, the principal of play still exists. One thing mentioned somewhere in Dungeon Crawl (it has manuals built in): when you are killed you likely had the means to save yourself in your possession.* I found this to be very true.
A new version, 26.0, is in the works, already. It supposedly will get rid of the food, altogether. Unlike in rogue, you can eat (some of) your kills and so the importance becomes extremely low. On the positive side, not storing true rations and 'chunks' (which rot quickly) opens up two new slots in one's limited pack.
* No - no restorable saves-along-the-way: perma-death. A game may be halted and restarted from that point. You could cheat, but that's no fun.
| Ravings en masse^ |
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| "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
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Thanks for the great post explaining Roguelikes so well. Very interesting.
W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: The game's a learning experience. That's the fascination.
That's really cool and is a big draw to these games for people who like that type of thing.
W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: when you are killed you likely had the means to save yourself in your possession.* I found this to be very true.
That's really great game / story design.
W∴ Balboos, GHB wrote: * No - no restorable saves-along-the-way: perma-death.
I thought that's what it meant but wasn't sure.
Great stuff, thanks again.
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I do lots of programming for fun. Nearly all of it involves 3D graphics like my avatar object. I call it a "swollen asterisk" but it is a construct called a supershape.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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raddevus wrote: Remember when you were a kid and you just wanted to learn to program some simple games?
(a) Get a BBC Micro.
(b) Stare at the >_ prompt.
(c) Type "10" and begin.
Back when simple was simple.
But of course I respect the book you're describing.
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I remember when I was a kid, and a program was a piece of paper that told me who was playing what role in a stage play, and what each act of the play depicted. Computers were a topic for science fiction books.  The first time I encountered an actual computer, it was behind a glass partition, and I had to hand the guy in a white lab coat my box of Hollerith cards, painstakingly punched late at night, and pray that the damned set would execute without error and produce a result the next day or so. That wasn't fun...
Will Rogers never met me.
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Roger Wright wrote: I remember when I was a kid, and a program was a piece of paper that told me who was playing what role in a stage play, and what each act of the play depicted.
Yeah, I was talking to my wife about "Choose Your Own Adventure[^]" novels which were like the first computer adventure games. 
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Should I sell my vacuum cleaner – it's only gathering dust?
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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