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Well said.
OriginalGriff wrote: you can learn the whole of C# in a week
Don't know if I agree with you completely here, but I see the point you are trying to make.
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An experienced developer with OOPs experience can pick up the whole of C# in an afternoon! (It's a very simple language - the only complications are lambdas and so forth.)
Becoming competent in using C# means learning the framework behind it in order to do anything substantial, and that takes time. Lots of time.
But I'd expect a developer with good .NET experience (for VB or C++ etc) to be fully operational in well under a day.
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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Read the question/title of the pole, it negates your response. That was my point. (Beginner/First Language) not experience developer.
Also, I don't know how many software shops you have worked in, but you are way off with your expectations. Just saying...
BTW,I upvoted you because I too, feel C# is the better language to learn for a beginner. 
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I think, I am a experienced developer - I can read C#-Code but I have problems in creating code like I can do it in VB.
And to learn C# in one day - I don't believe - even not in one week ...
But I agree with you (all) - in the moment C# would be the best language do learn. But if I remember back there where many programming languages "state of the time". Who knows what the future will bring ... 
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OriginalGriff wrote: And let's be honest, you can learn the whole of C# in a week, even if you are a slow student on your first language.
That is true of most languages.
If you have an important point to make, don't try to be subtle or clever. Use a pile driver. Hit the point once. Then come back and hit it again. Then hit it a third time - a tremendous whack.
--Winston Churchill
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IMHO, the easiest one to learn. Widely used too.
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I can't imagine someone falling in love with programming in C.
I'd say, give them something they can fall in love with to start with.
Something like java, C# or C++ (for the clever kids).
So give them two languages... C and one the those mentioned above.
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence."
<< please vote!! >></div>
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R. Erasmus wrote: I can't imagine someone falling in love with programming in C.
Why not. I did.
| "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | | "As far as we know, our computer has never had an undetected error." - Weisert | | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
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It lacks flair/style/panache. (Only my personal opinion --> I might add that I'm a full time C developer)
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence."
<< please vote!! >></div>
modified 14-Jul-15 4:54am.
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C shows the easiest and hardest part of programming. If you survive and you enjoyed it... then you may have future as developer.
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blfuentes wrote: If you survive and you enjoyed it... then you may have future as developer.
I never took C and I am a successful software engineer. I don't buy into the C/C++ requirements anymore. IMHO, they are no longer relevant, as prerequisites alone, to becoming a solid coder.
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It was just a "joke". Obviously, nowadays there is no need to choose one specific language to start with. In any case, C++ is still one of the best paid programming languages and if you start with it and you like what you learn, you may have many doors open.
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Auric Goldfinger wrote: I never took C and I am a successful software engineer. I don't buy into the C/C++ requirements anymore.
Some of it is snobbery. It all depends what you intend to do with your coding. Being a good coder has a lot to do with attitude, more so than language choice.
Kevin
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Kevin McFarlane wrote: Being a good coder has a lot to do with attitude, more so than language choice.
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My kid (14) just took a short introductory class developing Minecraft Mods (in Java  ).
Without a reason to learn something, many are unlikely to stick with it.
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Then C.
So some assembly, then C for sure.
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I agree with you Ron.
The deeper you get to know how machine works the more better programmer you will be.....!
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I'm 53. When I started monkeying with 8085 and 8031 chips, if you wanted to do something you had to MOV bytes from memory to registers and PUSH and POP yourself. While I'm not a fighter pilot coder, I'm sure it helps me somewhere.
It's not a notion that will go over too well as it's a little like saying a kid needs to take the time to nurse a crank started model A to work for a year to fully get what is going on in his or her Honda Accord.
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i think it's still the best language to develop your logic. After that you can move to any language like i did.
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When I started programming, C# was the language I began programming in. A lot of great features, compact structure of the program, elegant style and Visual Studio made things even great.
But as I kept on learning new things, I found that C# is a managed language*. You cannot work around with memory-management, unless you compile the program with unsafe context and many other similar things. For a beginner, language structure, design or solutions must not matter. For a new programmer, language that must provide him with functions that let him understand how a program works, should be a must. C++ is a great language, I had been a C fan for a great time, I have been working around for C, trying to convince people to use C instead of C++. But, there are some things that C doesn't support either. This era doesn't need much of those machine language scientists, but programmers with enough understanding of how to write, "Memory efficient programs" or "What might cost me a lot of CPU cycles".
In such cases it is better to learn C++, and then migrate to C# or Java. Most of the applications require you to build UI, think of your OS's settings application that requires you to enter commands to navigate through different portions. 
Objective-C or Swift, only and only if after 5 years you are going to remain in Apple business. Also, remember, PHP is not a programming language, instead just a scripting language used to create dynamic web page. It is written on top of C and is not a very much efficient language, most web developers still use it but trust me, you can write your own CGI and other scripts that can act as a scripting language for web. I would recommend ASP.NET. Remember: ASP.NET is also available on Ubuntu, Mac or other platforms is using PHP was a reason for staying on non-Windows OS. 
In the end, C++ is my recommendation. It is both, low-level (streams, memory-management etc.) and provides a lot of support for writing product drivers, high-level (Object-oriented programming, operator overloading etc.) so that you don't have to worry about writing your own modules. You can get it all build in including generic programming.
*Term "managed" is coined by Microsoft, for a language that runs under CLR.
The sh*t I complain about
It's like there ain't a cloud in the sky and it's raining out - Eminem
~! Firewall !~
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The first programming language I learned was QBasic in high school
The second one, I learned, was PASCAL. But start loving the programming when I started with C.
Then, I had to go through adjusting myself with OOP. I still love C. But if your target would be developing application and worry less then any OOP other than CPP will do.
Personally I hate Framework, waste of processing power. But stick your ass with framework, will do a lots of benefit. And I am not up for the benefits.
I do not fear of failure. I fear of giving up out of frustration.
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