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Mike Hankey26-Dec-20 6:16

Mike Hankey

26-Dec-20 6:16

Kinda like my ex; fickle, moody,... Smile | :)

I'm not sure how many cookies it makes to be happy, but so far it's not 27.

JaxCoder.com

CodeWraith26-Dec-20 7:00

CodeWraith

26-Dec-20 7:00

Order and chaos. There are enough people who can't keep order, even if their life depends on it. They are always struggling against their own chaos, but also are proud of their improvisations. Sometimes even rightfully so, but most of the time it's just too chaotic.

Then there are those who try to follow every rule fanatically, no matter where they come from or even contradict themselves. Those people are too rigid to ever stray off the beaten path. In the most extreme cases you get cargo cult programmers, who must include everything they have ever heard of without any understanding. Then we may even go full circle and get chaos by zealous order.

Trying something new is nothing bad, nor is insisting on not just improvising all the way. Striking the right balance is the hard part. Forgive those who have not found it yet. And try not to slide off to any side yourself.

I have lived with several Zen masters - all of them were cats.

His last invention was an evil Lasagna. It didn't kill anyone, and it actually tasted pretty good.

obermd28-Dec-20 3:42

obermd

28-Dec-20 3:42

CodeWraith wrote:
Trying something new is nothing bad, nor is insisting on not just improvising all the way. Striking the right balance is the hard part. Forgive those who have not found it yet. And try not to slide off to any side yourself.
I have lived with several Zen masters - all of them were cats.

Not only have you lived with those Zen masters, you've learned from them. Big Grin | :-D

pkfox26-Dec-20 12:07

pkfox

26-Dec-20 12:07

What has surprised you ? or is my question another surprise? Big Grin | :-D

"I didn't mention the bats - he'd see them soon enough" - Hunter S Thompson - RIP

Rick York26-Dec-20 17:04

Rick York

26-Dec-20 17:04

I know what you mean. I have seen a surprising amount of that lately.

"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"

Shao Voon Wong26-Dec-20 23:29

Shao Voon Wong

26-Dec-20 23:29

Which article of yours are you referring to? I am interested to read.

Every approach has its own pros and cons. Sad to say most readers stick to the commonly used practice and not see another approach with its own merits. For the next few months, I am going to write a very simple C++ JSON library/article with its own controversial design choice. Hopefully, few readers can see it simply for what it is. The rest of C++ world can continue to use their performant but convoluted JSON libraries.

Greg Utas27-Dec-20 1:37

Greg Utas

27-Dec-20 1:37

I believe he was referring to this article[^], which is scoring fairly well now but which had several "too chickenshit to comment" downvotes yesterday. All but one have disappeared, either removed by the admins or by several subsequent upvotes, which have the ability to purge outlier downvotes.

His other allusion, to "an article that flies right in the face of modern coding practices (and almost directly insults people that would disagree with its position)" could refer to one of my iconoclastic screeds. However, he uses the phrase "sucks donkey balls" and disses faddish development processes in this article[^], so he might be referring to that!

Robust Services Core | Software Techniques for Lemmings | Articles
The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing.

Performance woes. I'm appalled.

#realJSOP27-Dec-20 1:42

#realJSOP

27-Dec-20 1:42

Greg Utas wrote:
owever, he uses the phrase "sucks donkey balls" and disses faddish development processes

I'm a truth teller. Smile | :)

honey the codewitch26-Dec-20 4:46

26-Dec-20 4:46

Read 1231388 nodes and 20383269 characters in 1069.479000 ms at 17.765660MB/s
Skipped 1231388 nodes and 20383269 characters in 534.699000 ms at 35.534011MB/s
utf8 scanned 20383269 characters in 377.561000 ms at 50.322994MB/s
raw ascii i/o 20383269 characters in 62.034000 ms at 306.283651MB/s
raw ascii block i/o 19 blocks in 49.023000 ms at 387.573180MB/s

The first line is full JSON parsing

The second line is JSON "skipping" - a minimal read where it doesn't normalize anything it just moves as fast as possible through the document.

The third line is ut8 reading through my input source class but without doing anything JSON related

The fourth line is calling fgetc() in a loop

The fifth line is falling fread() in a loop and then scanning over the characters in each block (so i'm not totally cheating by not examining characters)

The issue here is the difference between my third line and the fourth line (utf8 scan vs fgetc). The trouble is even when I removed the encoding it made no measurable difference in speed. Underneath everything both are using fgetc. Even when I changed mine to block read using fread() it didn't speed things up.

I'm at a loss. I'm not asking a question here, mostly just expressing frustration because i have not a clue how to optimize this.

Real programmers use butterflies

harold aptroot26-Dec-20 4:58

harold aptroot

26-Dec-20 4:58

What does "utf8 scan" actually do? Perhaps you can use some of the UTF-8 tricks used by simdjson.

honey the codewitch26-Dec-20 5:28

26-Dec-20 5:28

That's actually what I'm going to do is look into simd eventually but it's not the utf8 encoding that is the issue. I turned it off and got a similar result.

There's something about the way my LexSource class is dealing with I/O, and/or I'm examining the codepoints/characers i get back way too many times.

I'm not sure which yet or if it's both.

Real programmers use butterflies

Daniel Pfeffer26-Dec-20 7:08

Daniel Pfeffer

26-Dec-20 7:08

The real question here is whether the code meets the performance bar. If it does, why bother optimising further? Life is too short...

Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.

honey the codewitch26-Dec-20 8:12

26-Dec-20 8:12

It's a library, ergo there is no performance bar. It would vary depending on the application of said library. However, a 6* slowdown compared to raw fgetc is worth investigating.

Real programmers use butterflies

trønderen26-Dec-20 9:01

trønderen

26-Dec-20 9:01

Haven't you got a profiler in your toolbox?

Doing any sort of optimizing without a profiler is futile. If you can't see which source lines consumes the most time, you won't have a clue about where and how to put your optimizing efforts.

honey the codewitch26-Dec-20 10:19

26-Dec-20 10:19

I just got done doing broad profiling. I haven't instrumented my code for specific profiling yet because I hadn't identified the bottleneck until I wrote that post.

I've been punting it until I got some other features implemented that needed doing (I needed them in there so I could benchmark them as well) but that's my next thing, because I just finished adding those features I mentioned just now.

Real programmers use butterflies

honey the codewitch26-Dec-20 16:57

26-Dec-20 16:57

Switching on characters is killing performance.

C++

switch(ch) {
    case '\t': // tab
        m_column+=TabWidth; // tabwidth is static const
        break;
    case '\n': // newline
        ++m_line;
        // fall through
    case '\r': // carriage return
        m_column=0;
        break;
    default:
        ++m_column;
        break;
}

This loses me 7-8MB/s in throughput on my machine pretty consistently. The problem is I switch on characters everywhere as this is a JSON parser. I can reduce some of my comparisons but not a lot of them because of the way my code is structured. The only other thing I can think of right now is building my own jump table schemes but I really don't want to do that so I'm trying to come up with something else.

Real programmers use butterflies

trønderen26-Dec-20 18:50

trønderen

26-Dec-20 18:50

If switching on a char takes an inordinate amount of time, I'd sure be curious to know how your compiler does it. It ought to be the most efficient way of switching there is: A jump table indexed by the switch variable, loading the program counter. In the old days, when CPUs were slow, that was the only way to do it. (The first Pascal compiler I used could only take alternatives spanning a 256-value range, because that was the largest jump table it could generate.)

Modern languages are far more flexible in their case expressions, often requiring the compiler to generate code like for an "if - elseif - elseif ... else" sequence. Maybe that is what your compiler has done here, maybe even generating "elseif"s for every char value, rather than collecting the "default" in an "else". If the compiler is scared of big jump tables, and therefore uses elseif-constructions, it rather should realize that this makes the code size grow far more than the size of a jump table!

I am just guessing! But it sounds crazy that an indexed jump would kill your performance; it just doesn't sound right. I would look at the generated code to see what happens. If you can't make the compiler do an indexed jump, maybe you are better off writing it in longhand, building the jump table from labels Smile | :)

.

I guess that writing it explicitly as "if - elseif..." would be better. Then you could also do the most common case first, so that only a single test is required: "if (ch > '\t') {...}".

I hate it when compilers force me to do the job that should be theirs, but maybe you have to, in this case!

honey the codewitch27-Dec-20 0:55

27-Dec-20 0:55

That's pretty much where I'm at. I'm using gcc, which should be pretty good about optimizing. What gets me is it's not any faster whether I'm using no switches, or -g

Real programmers use butterflies

honey the codewitch27-Dec-20 1:05

27-Dec-20 1:05

Don't I feel stupid.

C++

Approx stack size of local JSON stuff is 160 bytes
Read 1290495 nodes and 20383269 characters in 416.631000 ms at 45.603904MB/s
Skipped 1290495 nodes and 20383269 characters in 184.131000 ms at 103.187405MB/s
utf8 scanned 20383269 characters in 146.422000 ms at 129.761921MB/s
raw ascii i/o 20383269 characters in 58.902000 ms at 322.569692MB/s
raw ascii block i/o 19 blocks in 3.183000 ms at 5969.211436MB/s

Much better.

I was using the wrong gcc options. I'm used to msvc

Real programmers use butterflies