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I agree with you, but you've got to remember that microsoft invented vb to get the people programming on windows in a cupple of weeks.
This people were programming DOS applications in cobol, pascal, and so on...
They make rate ourself as "above average", and I've got to be thankful.
You've got to be thankful when you see this people consuming your activex and high performance libraries, they let you investigate, write complex code and all that things that make the life wonderful for people who want to get brain tunned on ...
I'm spanish, and all this kind of things you talk about, like that people living university with just vb skills is the same here and I guess all over the computing world.
Just three words: void main(void)
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Every programmer on my team is in his mid-to-late 30s. They each probably have at least 15-20 years of dev experience.
I'm 25, and I wrote my first program when I was 18. (That's not exactly true - I wrote several GWBasic programs in high school  .) Even though I have been working with (and learning from) them for the past 4 years, I still have a way to go before I catch up with them. The "experience factor" is huge, IMHO.
Jon Sagara
Hi! I'm Melanoma, Moley Russell's wart.
-- Uncle Buck
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Just when i have a look at the results...
the average seems to be above the average... 
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Thats because the average developer at CodeProject is into self-improvement and has great resources to use and learn from.
I am willing to bet that the average developer at everyones workplace does not effectively use CodeProject to become "above averaage".
Its all relative 
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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Paul Watt wrote:
Thats because the average developer at CodeProject is into self-improvement and has great resources to use and learn from.
playing the advocatus diaboli:
Or he has a bloated ego and is such an a**hole that he views anyone else as inferior?
And is not able to see how those who run the business laugh about him.
My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right.
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Paul Watt wrote:
Thats because the average developer at CodeProject is into self-improvement and has great resources to use and learn from.
good reply Paul.
I believe there are still lots of programmers who have no idea that CP exists.
CP being such a great resource, means that just by knowing of it's existance you are an improved programmer.
Regardz
Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I'm guessing the concept of a 2 hour movie showing two guys eating a meal and talking struck them as 'foreign'
Rob Manderson wrote:
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I have always been in to learning as much as I can to be able to anything programatically that I want. I have been developing for 8 years, and I just barely discovered CP's value last year. I have been hooked ever since.
With that being said, I can understand how a developer could visit this site or the other sites that exist and not understand the value that they offer.
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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Very good observation!!!
That's what brings doubts about the honest... isn't it?
Just three words: void main(void)
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it's one of the things that making me wanna leave every single day.
I'm much better than all of my co-workers (maybe except for one) and it pisses me off. not beacuse they are not as good as I am, but because they don't want to be. I need excelent people around me to have the motivation to get even better.
ahh, this will kill me at the end (or at least make me leave here...)
Noam
Noam Ben Haim
Web Developer
Intel
noam.ben.chaim@intel.com
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What worries me is that you work at Intel. 
Maybe I will by an AMD next time.
Jason Henderson
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Gandhi
articles profile
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not beacuse they are not as good as I am, but because they don't want to be.
I totally agree. This was one of my major reasons for leaving corporate and team development efforts and becoming a consultant. Actually, this was one of the reasons for dropping out of college too. Everything nowadays seems to be oriented toward the lowest common denominator, and I'm sick of it. It's a blessing when I find someone that actually WANTS to improve themselves, regardless of whether it's coding or just plain living.
Marc
Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"
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You know, there's a person like you at my work.... he THINKS he's above average but is not, I've seen his code and designs... it's his attidude that makes me want to leave everyday... he says the same things... "I need a better environment to thrive... " blah, blah , wah, wah... if you're so good than why hasn't your "greatness" spread amongst the others?
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vetroxl wrote:
if you're so good than why hasn't your "greatness" spread amongst the others?
You missed a key point in his statement:
it pisses me off. not beacuse they are not as good as I am, but because they don't want to be.
That says a lot as to why greatness will not spread.
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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vetroxl wrote:
if you're so good than why hasn't your "greatness" spread amongst the others?
well, mainly because the buisness environment is not encouraging people to take risks, and to invebt time in doing thing better is a risk.
Besides, I am doing my best to pull my co-workers "up" by giving lectures on advanced topics (how to do ADO.NET, just a bit more than the smaples...)
Besta Regards
Noam
Noam Ben Haim
Web Developer
Intel
noam.ben.chaim@intel.com
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I know what you mean to a certain extent. I like working with talented developers because I learn from them. Up until my last job I have had the most experience out of any of my co-workers and usually learned from books and websites.
At my last job there was a diverse range of developers with lots of experience each. I was able to hold my own on the topics that I knew the most about, but my knowledge grew quickly on things like socket and multithreaded programming because of having more experienced people around.
Not having experienced developers does make me want to leave. Because I like to help other people improve their skills as well. However when people dont care about self-improvement that is another thing.
Have you ever met any developers that like to read non-work related books during business hours ???
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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Im above adverage and i want to be even MORE ABOVE lol. I am motivated to wanting to be the best of the best of the best of the best of the best personally id find it irrtating as well if everyone else did not feel the same.
- LiquidKnight
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..but learning quickly.
My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right.
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jhwurmbach wrote:
..but learning quickly.
Well done dude. 
Cheers and best of luck. ![Rose | [Rose]](https://codeproject.global.ssl.fastly.net/script/Forums/Images/rose.gif)
Regards,
Rohit Sinha
Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln
The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous
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Me too mate.. I read half the stuff on CP and I don't understand much.. will get there in the end...
www.beachwizard.com/travelogue[^]
"I spent a lot of my money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered"
George Best.
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It depends on the topic. While IMHO I am above average in GUI development (programming  ), there are areas where others are better than me. Therefore I cannot give a general statement and answer to this poll 
Regards
Thomas
Disclaimer:
Because of heavy processing requirements, we are currently using some of your unused brain capacity for backup processing. Please ignore any hallucinations, voices or unusual dreams you may experience. Please avoid concentration-intensive tasks until further notice. Thank you.
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it depends also on eval parameters.
I can produce the same quality software than others in less time and with better docs... User can say that I'm at same level (on their perspective), but I'm not (and I hope I'll paid better for this).
Always remember differences from professional programmers (that must take in account costs) and others.
Bye
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Your ability as a developer doens't depend on how well you are at a given technology - but rather how you approach the discipline itself.
cheers,
Chris Maunder
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Thomas Freudenberg wrote:
While IMHO I am above average in GUI development (programming ),
![Jig | [Dance]](https://codeproject.global.ssl.fastly.net/script/Forums/Images/jig.gif)
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My guess:
Just about all of us are "way above average" because we know the virtues of Code Project and frequent it often 
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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