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I think about this being that I work with Doctors that make 10 times my salary or more...
John
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So much for morality.
Making your living off of sick people?
Exploiting the dire misfortunes of others?*
Taking part in impoverishing people - entire families?
That's the crowd you want to hang with ???
* As is oft said by MD's: "We bury our mistakes" - but still send the bill.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to stop bothering them and just go away?" - Balboos HaGadol
"It's a sad state of affairs, indeed, when you start reading my tag lines for some sort of enlightenment?" - Balboos HaGadol
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Well, that's one way to put it.
Actually, I sort of think of it as making a living helping sick people.
Maybe I look at it slightly differently here in the UK. We have a publicly funded National Health Service, and the vast majority of people would agree that it's a good system (although everyone would agree that it has its problems) and as far as know it's never been responsible for impoverishing entire families - in fact it's supposed to provide largely free health care to everybody, no matter what their financial situation.
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... heads up! I might still be a bit too naive for the harsh *real* world since I am currently doing my master studies (aeronautical engineering, focus on control systems) but I feel quite a bit proud of what I do. Even if my on the job experience is somewhat limited at this point.
My mother is a doctor in fact, but still I feel that I am doing exactly the thing I am most capable of. I must agree that the public reputation of engineers is not comparable to doctors but still: people do need us even if they might not realise it.
To me, it seems as if I should simply *assume* respect for the engineer's work quietly. So whenever our beloved politicians do their "Europe's only natural resources is it's brains" speech I can't resist remembering our foreign trade balance that is made up by *our* machines and technology - and everything is fine.
As long as my own family respects me few things may really touch me. At least this is my attitude.
enough ranting for today. 
Best regards from Germany
Arne
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Hi Arne,
You raise some good points, but it has to be said that engineers have a much better reputation in your country. Germany is world-renowned for the quality of its engineering (rightly or wrongly, but that's another subject) and so I guess that engineers are a source of national pride. I just find it disappointing that it's not the case in the UK too.
Regards,
Chris Chambers.
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I can understand how u feel, but we have to understand every one can not be a doctor. Software Engineer is every where in today's life even in doctor profession to, even i have made software for doctor. When people start asking me when good for your profession i give them numbers of use of Software Engineer. I really proud what i do. And Every Software Engineer should also be.
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You're quite right, and I am very proud of what we do. It's just a shame that so few other non-engineers are not as proud of what we do, despite their total reliance on our entire industry.
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Having been told at the age of 30 that I did not have tha aptitude to be a programmer (perhaps I could not read punch cards?), and not having taken up programming until age about 40, if I knew what I know now I would have taken it up at age 5 - had computers (on the desktop) been available. I am now nearly 61 by the way.
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Way to not let people tell you what you can't do. Congrats, and keep it up!
Sad but true: 4/3 of Americans have difficulty with simple fractions.
There are 10 types of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
{o,o}.oO( Check out my blog! )
|)””’) http://pihole.org/
-”-”-
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I remember punch cards also, but with a degree in engineering I have no idea why I am still programming.
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... If I was born in an other century, I could not imagine what else i should do.
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I've often thought that question myself! I think it would have to be some sort of mechanical computer, like the Babbage machines or something.
Either that or I would invent this crazy hypothetical data model in my head with no physical means to realize it, lol.
Sad but true: 4/3 of Americans have difficulty with simple fractions.
There are 10 types of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
{o,o}.oO( Check out my blog! )
|)””’) http://pihole.org/
-”-”-
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Yup. Don't have the physical muscle to dig ditches or do hard labor or? Logical thinking just isn't rewarded anywhere else. In fact, it's more often a handicap. See: Logical Thinking is not on the TEST[^]
In fact, now that I think about it, aside from the actual coding, logical thinking isn't much rewarded at work either 
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Owen37 wrote: Logical thinking just isn't rewarded anywhere else
You can always become a mathematician, spend the rest of your life writing scary symbols on your own blackboard and have a spiritual reward. It makes sense, I know such people and they seem to feel happy with their passion.
Greetings - Gajatko
Portable.NET is part of DotGNU, a project to build a complete Free Software replacement for .NET - a system that truly belongs to the developers.
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I _did_ like math; once I got to Calculus. The stuff before just didn't make much sense. Especially Geometry.
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Owen37 wrote: The stuff before just didn't make much sense.
And that's why you liked it? BTW I like Calculus because it is used everywere and I find it amazing.
Greetings - Gajatko
Portable.NET is part of DotGNU, a project to build a complete Free Software replacement for .NET - a system that truly belongs to the developers.
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Yes, I liked it because it finally made sense of all that math I took.
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In the old days, the software engineers of today where usually Magicians.
Not an illusionist like David Copperfield, but real ones, like Aleister Crowley.
Its a lot to do with Poetry, Aligning of the Elements and Nute Boiling - just like coding...
Ittay Ophir
ittay.ophir@gmail.com
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Software development is my 4th career, and I only started (seriously and professionally) at around 26-27.
I would have loved to have gotten into it in my teens.
xacc.ide - now with TabsToSpaces support IronScheme - 1.0 beta 1 - out now! ((lambda (x) `((lambda (x) ,x) ',x)) '`((lambda (x) ,x) ',x))
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leppie wrote: Software development is my 4th career, and I only started (seriously and professionally) at around 26-27.
How did you manage to fit 4 careers in by 26! I only managed 1 in that time. Some brief spells in other jobs, but barely careers, more like sidelines.
Simon
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1. Studied management accounting, got bored, dropped out (4 years)
2. Went to England, did IT support, got fed up with users (3 years)
3. Worked for father's business in Marketing (finished my degree in Marketing, did not like the social thing) (2 years)
4. Software dev (6-7 years, to present)
* Estimated times
xacc.ide - now with TabsToSpaces support IronScheme - 1.0 beta 1 - out now! ((lambda (x) `((lambda (x) ,x) ',x)) '`((lambda (x) ,x) ',x))
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leppie wrote: my 4th career
It's my second. Started at 30+.
Kevin
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There is a difference between having a job for a couple of years and a career; it's just about possible to have four careers in a lifetime - but not in a decade.
"If you reward everyone, there will not be enough to go around, so you offer a reward to one in order to encourage everyone."
Mei Yaochen in the 'Doing Battle' section of Sun Tzu's: Art of War.
.
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Young man, I was 36 when I took my first cours and 41 when I got my first job wich I prompltly lost 6 month later when the company run out of money in the big bouble 2000. A lot of experience and a lot of strange software later Im still strugling to reach that feeling of securety I felt in my first real position back in the 70s. But my wife tells me she won´t go for anything less (in terms of salary  I love solving problems and I think I am quite good at it but I won´t solve that, no I won´t solve that....
<? I fell in to the xml pool and ?>
<I>
<am>
<strugling>to be well formed</strugling>
</am>
</I>
Java
C#
Gupta Team Developer 3.1
VC++ 2003
Oracle 8i79i
W2K-XP
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