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dandy7212-Feb-21 3:16

dandy72

12-Feb-21 3:16

The more from this thread I read, the more I get this feeling of deja vu. I can't remember where it was, it might even have been here on CP, but I was in a discussion forum--years ago--and someone showed up with the same sort of story and was shooting everything down because of some supposed criminal record he didn't even have, and he kept going back to that and trying to convince others he was wasting his time trying anything at all.

It was rather infuriating to try to reason with him. I don't know how social workers deal with people who don't want to help themselves.

And mentioning he got advice from Reddit...c'mon, this is such a tired old meme it's not even funny.

Kris Lantz12-Feb-21 3:43

Kris Lantz

12-Feb-21 3:43

Deja vu? But...but, you don't understand! This person's story is so much more different than the other person! Laugh | :laugh:

musefan12-Feb-21 4:21

12-Feb-21 4:21

Yeah, he's 25. The other person 2 years ago was only 23!

dandy7212-Feb-21 6:26

dandy72

12-Feb-21 6:26

The thought did cross my mind. But I'm thinking maybe 5 years ago.

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 2:25

11-Feb-21 2:25

i dont understand why you specify that i have a conviction when i said I didnt.

musefan11-Feb-21 2:31

11-Feb-21 2:31

Well, why did you choose to mention it in the first place? If you don't want people to reference it, then you probably shouldn't have included it.

Maximilien is simply stating that it is not relevant to the advice he is giving you.

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 2:37

11-Feb-21 2:37

I mentioned the fact the i wasnt convicted to provide details rather than just say that i was arrested and ppl would automatically assume that i was in prison also which wasnt the case. look not to try and sound rude, but maybe it was bad idea coming here looking for advice.

honey the codewitch11-Feb-21 2:58

honey the codewitch

11-Feb-21 2:58

I think anywhere you go asking for advice and then either not even reading it or dismissing it out of hand is going to go badly for you.

You were told what expunged means. By several people. You do not have an arrest as far as anyone is concerned. It never happened. That's what expunged means.

I think anywhere you go asking for advice and then taking every comment, even those not directed at you as some kind of personal slight is going to go badly for you.

Maybe the problem isn't the venue.

Real programmers use butterflies

CHill6011-Feb-21 3:01

CHill60

11-Feb-21 3:01

You're being waay too over-sensitive - why would people automatically assume that you were in prison just because you had been arrested? They wouldn't.

Maximillien was not saying you had been convicted, he was saying it was not relevant to what else he had to say, he just didn't take care not to use "that" word.

You're getting some good advice here, stick with it but stop over-reacting - the internet can be a harsh place, but freelancing can be harsher. Get used to it.

And look "Expunge" means "to obliterate completely" so either the potential criminal record no longer exists or you are using the wrong term. If it no longer exists then it cannnot crop up in a background check - or at least not the sort of background check that non-government agencies can run Laugh | :laugh:

I think @Nelek has the right idea - do a check on yourself to see what might crop up.

musefan11-Feb-21 3:07

11-Feb-21 3:07

CHill60 wrote:
the internet can be a harsh place, but freelancing can be harsher

Words to live by Thumbs Up | :thumbsup:

Nelek11-Feb-21 8:40

11-Feb-21 8:40

CHill60 wrote:

I think @Nelek has the right idea - do a check on yourself to see what might crop up.

Thanks. Better to know for yourself first hand, what others might find or not find, that brings perspective and can help avoiding some situations.

M.D.V.

If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.

musefan11-Feb-21 3:02

11-Feb-21 3:02

It's a bad idea to go anywhere for advice if you are not open to listening to it.

The whole point of it being expunged is so that you don't need to mention it. Not to us, not to potential employees (with some exceptions, do some research), not to anybody that you don't want to.

Whatever you try to do from here, do it with the assumption that you have no history whatsoever. Your history does not give you less chance than anybody else trying to be a developer, so don't let it hold you back, and certainly don't use it as an excuse for failure.

If you want to be a dev, then listen to the advice we are giving you. Build up a portfolio, get some training/education, do whatever you can to convince somebody that you are going to be useful to them. Plenty of places will hire for a junior who has little experience (but shows promise), nobody will hire a freelancer who "did a bit of python".

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 3:23

11-Feb-21 3:23

musefan wrote:
nobody will hire a freelancer who "did a bit of python".

I have done more than just "a bit of python" as I've been learning and practicing since last august. And another thing there have been times I went to other forums and told my exact same story and have to been told multiple mediocre answers. I did run a background check on myself, but it was a state keyword state background check and nothing showed up, but is that suppose to make a difference?

musefan11-Feb-21 3:34

11-Feb-21 3:34

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
I have done more than just "a bit of python" as I've been learning and practicing since last august.

That's good, but it isn't me you need to convince. Write a CV and apply for some junior python jobs, see how you get on!

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
I did run a background check on myself, but it was a state keyword state background check and nothing showed up, but is that suppose to make a difference?

You don't need it to make a difference, you are the only one holding yourself back. Forget your history, you don't need to disclose it to anyone, get on with your life and start applying for jobs you like. Just don't expect to get the first few you go for.

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 10:23

11-Feb-21 10:23

musefan wrote:
You don't need it to make a difference, you are the only one holding yourself back. Forget your history, you don't need to disclose it to anyone

this isnt me holding myself back. And i said when it comes to this expungement crap as i said i've heard too many things from other people mainly on the internet.

musefan12-Feb-21 0:44

12-Feb-21 0:44

If you don't want to listen to us internet people, then go and get some proper legal advice.

Nelek11-Feb-21 8:47

11-Feb-21 8:47

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
I have done more than just "a bit of python" as I've been learning and practicing since last august

Sorry, but 7 months of learning and practicing... still is "a bit of python".

But even though, that is not a real handicap, because programming languages can be learnt. More important is how you focus on problem solving, how you search for the errors, how you work out alternatives, how do you search for information, how you assimilate contents, how you communicate with others (and not only technically speaking)...
patience, self confidence but with modesty, niceness, reliability...

In my opinion those skills are more valious than technical content with your age.

And sorry to be that direct... you are already showing lack of some of them with your answers.

M.D.V.

Nelek11-Feb-21 2:46

11-Feb-21 2:46

Here in Germany there are companies that will ask for a police report to check if you have a record. If you really want to be sure, I would ask for one and check if the entry you are commenting is clear enough saying that you got expugned.

Said that... I agree with almost everything the others have said. So I won't repeat it.

Things that I didn't see...
You don't only have to know about taxes, you need to have a good money management. Freelancing can bring a lot of money at once and then be months without a project. If you don't have a strategy, it might get very uncomfortable pretty quick.
You have to have a good time / priority management, because you might (if you are lucky) have several projects at once and almost every customer wants his stuff for yesterday.
You need to know your real / fair value, only because there are guys earning 5 or 6 figures salary per project, it doesn't mean that you can ask for it without being that good. And depending on the pissed customer, it might get really difficult to get more projects in the area.

and many more...

TL;DR;
it might be really good, but it is not an easy way.

M.D.V.

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 3:01

11-Feb-21 3:01

Nelek wrote:
Said that... I agree with almost everything the others have said. So I won't repeat it.

For starters I don't live in Germany I live in the US and what have other people said in this thread that you agree with? because I'm pretty sure it has been nothing helpful.

musefan11-Feb-21 3:14

11-Feb-21 3:14

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
because I'm pretty sure it has been nothing

There is plenty of useful stuff, but you seem to be ignoring it and focus on wrongly perceived insults.

So forget the question about freelancing or not... first thing you need to do is sort your attitude out, because you won't get anywhere if you have a bad attitude. Simple fact. Be open to criticism, accept advice from people who have experience in the domain, and if a genuine insult does pop up... just let it go, not worth your time to react.

Now... do you take that as a useful bit of advice, or an attack on you as a person? Think about it before you answer.

Nelek11-Feb-21 8:48

11-Feb-21 8:48

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
For starters I don't live in Germany I live in the US

For Starters... two of three companies that wanted my/our police record were US-Companies with sit in Germany (and just in case you ask... the third one was a company in other land because of some visa ?finickiness?)

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
what have other people said in this thread that you agree with?

Here you have:
#1

Quote:
The most important thing to start with is that you have good solid experience in multiple languages and frameworks, as you have to go where the work is. With only some Python experience I think you may struggle to find work. It may be an idea to talk to recruitment agencies in your locality to see what skills are in demand and whether freelance work is called for.

Quote:
If it got expunged and there was no conviction what's the problem? Just don't mention it on your resume,
...
I'm a freelancer. It would be a pretty bad idea to try to learn the ropes while freelancing. Spend some years working for a dev house or two so you can learn how to do this professionally.

The *only* way to learn how to write software properly professionally is learning from others on the job.

Quote:
Are you good at keeping organized ? (project management)
Are you good at managing your money ? (for taxes purpose)
Are you good at selling yourself every couple of months ? (get new contracts)

Those are the contents I was referring to, and if you don't see their usefulness...

Throwaway888xxxx wrote:
because I'm pretty sure it has been nothing helpful.

With that attitude you better not start as a freelancer, because if you treat people trying to help you like this, then... you are going to have it pretty difficult to keep contacts / customers, and freelancing is a big % about your professional / social network.

M.D.V.

modified 11-Feb-21 15:03pm.

snorkie11-Feb-21 2:51

snorkie

11-Feb-21 2:51

I think Freelancing is a bad choice for a new dev. You need more experience first.

Smaller companies (less than 50 people) don't have the super strict requirements of large companies and are a wonderful place to learn skills. My happiest (and longest term) positions are with small companies.

As a fellow developer, the only think I truly care about with my co-workers is if they do a good job at work. If you worked with me, I would care that you carry your weight on the team (equivalent to your position). Then as I got to know you, chances are you're a decent person and I would like that about you too. Your past is behind you, and what you do today makes more of a difference.

Go apply and somebody will pick you up. Then you can prove you're the person you say you are!

Hogan

Throwaway888xxxx11-Feb-21 2:58

11-Feb-21 2:58

snorkie wrote:
You need more experience first.

I realize that and I do have a couple of projects so isnt that "experience"?

snorkie wrote:
Your past is behind you, and what you do today makes more of a difference.

easy for to say. anyways im not trying to get a job in bigtech or anything, but i really don't think a small dev company is even gonna give me a chance. nice try with this half decent response though

snorkie11-Feb-21 3:01

snorkie

11-Feb-21 3:01

You've got to start looking up. This was a serious response. If you treat yourself and others this way, you may not get ahead.

I've been programming professionally for 20 plus years and still remember my first job and not knowing anything. Its a struggle to get past imposter syndrome. I wish you the best in your career.

Hogan

musefan11-Feb-21 3:43