|
Part II of the cutting of my programming teeth was in the video game world, using C++, where the rule was that exceptions are very much last-resort, only for events that should not happen and are generally unrecoverable, at least without some kind of restart.
One thing I have often found difficult in C# is trying to avoid exceptions. Even when I have tried to do exceptions properly and catch the correct type etc., I find the program gets worse, not better, because, without looking up every single API call, you never know what exceptions might be thrown. Addiction recovery begins with admission so I will now admit here that I usually end with a catch( Exception ) {}.
To me, in a language, it is as if you need one of two things: either a slimline composite return type that encapsulates any return value and also some kind of error indication (I know - dangerously close to the error return codes of old Win32 programming); or you need two basic types of exception - real ones that should ideally never happen, and a more everyday exception meaning, "Something has gone wrong in my code so don't continue using this value I am about to return to you."
Thank you to anyone taking the time to read my posts.
|
|
|
|
|
why isn't Microsoft more popular?
- C# is a feature language. they constantly add new features. although this seems the only way for a language, for me it's the least preferable. i adore languages that have a mission to fulfill and that's it. the creators of those languages had to make compromises upfront. C (portable assembly) is one such language. LISP, Lua, Go, Component Pascal, TCL, FORTH... all small languages.
- i don't know if this is 100% true, but i bet that C#'s philosophy at the time of it's inception, was same as Java's. only OOP is good, everything else is inferior. for me that's like what Hitler used to preach.
I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.
Bruce Lee
|
|
|
|
|
Don't they continually add to C++? After a few years break, I recently returned to C++ and could barely read what I was seeing.
There's truth in what you say and obviously you have an absolute right to your opinion but I honestly think some people justifiably decided to hate Microsoft in the late 90s and have never looked again.
Thank you to anyone taking the time to read my posts.
|
|
|
|
|
that is a huge problem and i can't understand why it is happening. imagine you know C++, JavaScript and say Rust. you work at a company. large scale project that involves all three languages or at least two.
6 years latter you leave this company and go to work on a fresh new project at a new company. once again it involves C++, JS and Rust or at least two of them.
so now, because there were C++ x20 and C++ 2023, ECMAScript 2019..2025 and Rust 3.x 4.x and the newest Rust 2025 (they will change it to some other naming version) you don't know any of the languages you have worked with for the last 6 years in continuation.
a common book on good programming practices is on average 400-500 pages, but the core stuff would be 200 pages. those good programming practices that will make a competitive programmer write better code in FORTRAN and COBOL that a beginner in the safest programming langue in the world.
how do we get from 200 pages of good programming advice to a stream of a dozen languages that endlessly evolve every year?
"justifiably decided to hate Microsoft in the late 90s and have never looked again."
C# was designed by Anders Hejlsberg of Borland. the creator of Turbo Pascal and Delphi. Microsoft destroyed Borland and many many other companies so they can give away money for charity?
instead of giving away money for charity they could have taken away less from other companies.
nothing i say is against you or your opinion. it is only my opinion. i don't like C# because it is class oriented and because it is from Microsoft.
|
|
|
|
|
that's a good question, I still use it quite often in my work. I'm working on my own streaming service right now. I found useful info about streaming service like netflix here and decided to give it a try. This article could be useful for beginners.
modified 11-Sep-20 3:51am.
|
|
|
|
|
I think there's a few reasons.
1) In VS, it's a go to language for desktop development, yes and sorry, there are tens of thousands of those in use every day. No need for cross platform, ever. While it's still a substantial market, it has been eclipsed by cross platform stuff. I know it's fully capable of that, but you start to lose the advantage of the language in a hurry.
2) To my first case point above, there's also a split between vb.net and C# that dilutes the usage. (Fire away!) Being bilingual, those translations back and forth are pretty easy in the .net environment. Yes, I know the differences but over the years there's a lot of parity and you may never hit a wall in vb.net that is solved in C# in real world apps.
3) Without a good reason, you're not going to move from C/C++ to C#. You might if find yourself in a RAD desktop scenario, but you're probably not chasing that world if it's out of your comfort zone.
4) Programming has matured some into more of a profession. Your eye doctor doesn't see some new ortho procedure and think; "hey, I'll be an orthopedist". I still glance at the newest languages, but it's not the 80's or 90's and having time to play with a massive language isn't a hobby anymore.
The be all, end all, one size fits all theory (Java,lmao) hasn't really panned out well. Languages are tools that have their best use. You can put a screw in with a hammer, but it's liable not to be pretty.
|
|
|
|
|
I believe that there are too many languages available for any one language to become the number #1 language in use.
Though I am completely fluent in C# and have built quite a few C# applications over the years, I still prefer VB.NET for all my own development endeavors. This comes from my years as a DBase\FoxBase\Clipper developer in the late 1980s and 1990s.
One cannot also assume that surveys are actually are a reflection of popularity for any one language as all surveys have built in biases. As my wife has always told me, marketing and surveys is all about what answer(s) you want to obtain and then developing surveys to attain them.
Nonetheless, as some commenters here have said, C# cannot compete with those areas where C\C++ must be used and\or is preferred. And nor can it compete with the many niche languages that have popped up over the years that have very loyal proponents, even though C# can do most if not all of what these languages provide.
You also still have a lot of Microsoft haters out there who would never give a Microsoft product a legitimate chance.
But do not despair, C# and VB.NET will be around for some time to come... 
Steve Naidamast
Sr. Software Engineer
Black Falcon Software, Inc.
blackfalconsoftware@outlook.com
|
|
|
|
|
It is a (mostly) general language, but best suited to app development, there is a whole world of development that C#/net can't touch or has no part of.
|
|
|
|
|
I think there's a lot of great reasons here that focus on language alone, and a handful that talk about how software is released once it leaves the IDE. While Azure has implemented a lot of nifty features to make deployment easier, to me the biggest draw back is the release and management of applications in Prod.
Working in a number of FinTech companies, they used C# but only in very limited ways.
Who wants to support IIS servers and deal with the underlying Windows server? It's a nightmare. It took a long time to get decent config management tools to work with Windows. While linux goes bad too, patching issues and system failures feel more severe on Windows server. For the majority of applications especially anything customer facing Java rules the roost. I'm not thrilled about Java / Tomcat but I rather support that then anything C#.
I've never seen a .net core deployment in the wild, though I would love for things to go that way. I've thought about specializing in that area to assist orgs trying to accomplish that but definitely a lot of sharp edges to consider. The horror stories seem to end in a full stop not compatible not supported by Microsoft.
|
|
|
|
|
I like C#, but it is not really cross-platform, requiring some time to get changes ported to Linux, which are always missing some libraries, and I have no idea if it is supported on Apple machines.
|
|
|
|
|
I am definitively a C# guy, but I generally love programming so I've also learned/used JavaScript, VB.Net, LISP, Python, misc other obscure scripting languages and I am currently taking a C++ class so I can effectively play with some specific SDK's. Learning these languages have each taught me different lessons. There is no correct language, some are just plain easier to deploy in different places. The Microsoft (open source!) .NET 5 gives me some hope that I'll get to use C# more frequently in my future.
I certainly don't understand the Anti-Microsoft groups. In very recent years, MS has been a beacon of what I've always fundamentally believed needed to happen; IE, the dismantling of proprietary platforms and file types so that all things have the potential to interoperate. That is the only path to "thriving" in the next era and the companies (regardless of their size) that continue to live in a "black box" state will someday die if they don't focus on being the "open world" stars instead of the "closed world" wardens.
|
|
|
|
|
It's simple for me...
How much can I trust MSFT to not break their old projects.
We have 20-30 and even 50 year old code, still running in production!
Have you loaded a .NET 1 project and recompiled it lately?
My past experience with MSFT was when they abandoned 16 bit C++ support.
We had to buy a Borland C++ Compiler to compile the MSFT 32 bit C++ (new features),
into 16 bit code which 90% of our "clients" required as their DLL.
Don't get me started on the nightmare we had doing a Mobile Project in C#.
We are starting to embrace C# now that Rider exists.
It's not the language, it's the ecosystem the language ends up requiring.
Both for compiling and for running!
|
|
|
|
|
I can't argue with your real-world experience but I once had to compile some 90s C code (i.e. not that old) and it took me ages to get it to compile with either the MS compiler or GCC.
I spent years writing C++ in video games and am well aware of its positives and negatives and why it is still essential for so many projects. All I am saying is that, in my opinion, C# is a better language than surveys would suggest and I agree with many other comments on here that argue there is bias and prejudice in the system.
Thank you to anyone taking the time to read my posts.
|
|
|
|
|
C# is my #1 lang BUT IMO its because of its refusal to acknowledge the JIT is a failed idea so full of baggage & half baked ideas people who still argue for JIT just end up making excuses for why it lags behind at this point. The lang and runtime need to be as one... which is another issue with .NET
It takes more time to port giving you slower and more bloated code.
|
|
|
|
|
Well when it started and for a long time after there was an Open Source hostile environment at Microsoft. Ballmer did not do it any favors for sure.
Java was and is more widely supported due to it embracing the open source community and consequently having hundreds of ways to do any one thing. Now Java has inertia on its side and C# still is in its infancy (comparatively) as far as open source is concerned.
Basically Microsoft bit itself in the butt.
|
|
|
|
|
Here's my $0.02
.netcore is just not that popular for corss platform stuff, and is not supported on that many platforms; basically they missed the opportunity that Java didn't, in that regard, and they didn't have their "Android" booster as Java did.
Performance wise C# doesn't compete with C++.
It's not as easy to learn as Python is.
It's not a popular language for game development, Unity is at best a platform to learn game programming, I haven't seen any AAA game made with it.
It's used mainly for insanely boring projects, like medium complexity Windows specific enterprise apps, it isn't really a goto language/platform for multimedia, machine learning, gamedev or math heavy stuff. Really, if you look at what C# devs are being hired for, you can get depressed.
|
|
|
|
|
I was part-way through a professional C++ course, just beginning Windows programming, when C# first came out and the course switched to C#, which annoyingly meant an extra year of study. I liked it at first, though the class library (v.1) was crap in places, and the push to make XML universal flopped (thankfully), but at least the language was nice and ideal for Windows apps. Then windows apps went out of fashion and C# kept pumping out new versions (in that irritating MS way). The class libraries certainly improved but they made too many fundamental changes to the language for my liking and I found myself wondering if I was coding anything in the 'right way'. Then I discovered Java and never looked back, although it is not great for the web, I use JS and PHP for that (I don't like ASP.NET). Java suites my intuition and with it the code just flows, I don't have to worry about all the quirks of C# and its often cumbersome syntax. C# meanwhile has focused on ASP.NET which I absolutely hate and could never get into. C# does have some nice features though and I continued with it for some years just on a hobby basis, but I haven't bothered with it for the past few years now.
|
|
|
|
|
Is egg salad just really fresh chicken salad?
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies.
-- Sarah Hoyt
|
|
|
|
|
These are non-commutative operators:
Egg (turned into salad) (grows old) =/= Egg (grows old) (turned into salad)
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
|
|
|
|
|
I had to scramble a bit for this reply, but I've never heard that yolk before.
With a bit of luck, once will be enough.
| Ravings en masse^ |
|---|
| "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein | | "If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Must...resist...urge to create a YouTube account just to correct every message that's wrong...(so, so wrong)...
|
|
|
|
|
Obligatory xkcd: Duty Calls
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
|
|
|
|
|
Oldie but goodie. 
Jeremy Falcon
|
|
|
|
|
Jeremy; dude! Long time no read. Welcome back!
Software Zen: delete this;
|
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
