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I was on reddit just now advising someone on an ESP32 question regarding its ability to do over the air updates to its firmware.
Long story short, he's making things for family and wants to be able to patch and deploy when there are fixes.
I told him for his use case it's a mug's game, because it won't be completely hands off/zero touch, and it requires infrastructure, such as something to serve the new firmware. At the end of the day, your user/family member will still need help, at which point reprogramming it manually via USB is just as easy.
But I've always been more or less against these auto-rollout things anyway. I like it in theory, but I quickly learned that in practice it's anywhere from clunky (Java updates) to evil (Windows or Ubuntu updates) in terms of what they do, and they aren't hands off. At the end of the day, the user is going to be interrupted and expected or worse, required to intervene when things inevitably go south.
At its very worst it feels like an excuse to release without thorough QA.
Am I the only one who feels this way?
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
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nope, I hate auto updates.
But then again we (cp users) are pretty much all tech savvy and will update our devices on a fairly regular basis. It was one of my main reasons for going to Linux. I am in more control.
That being said. The vast majority of users just can't be bothered to run an auto update. So when I setup someones machine. It is set to auto update after a few days after the 2nd tuesday since that seems to be the go to date that people do rollouts. It isn't perfect but it is what it is.
I usually try to set the schedule for middle of the night and hope like hell they don't have anything open.
I probably should setup a message that pops up on their machine during the day before that says something along the lines of "hey we are going to update this tonight. Save your work. Close things you want closed. No you can't stop it"
To err is human to really elephant it up you need a computer
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I like updates that
a) fix things
b) add sensible features that make sense
c) don't interrupt and make a song and dance
The Apple airpod updates are my current favourite because I never know when they happen, generally don't notice anything changed, but I always have the feeling that I have the latest firmware, always. I'd be annoyed as hell if I had to manually update the firmware in my airpods.
On the other hand was a modem I used that required signing into a server, downloading, unpacking, uploading to the modem's internal server, and instantiating the update. And then being ready to rollback with the backup they asked you to make. So, so stupid.
cheers
Chris Maunder
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ditto
"A little time, a little trouble, your better day"
Badfinger
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Somehow, the instant I hear "auto-update" nowdays, the first thing that comes to mind is the Sony 3D TV my dad bought a few years ago (when so-called 3D was all the rage).
Being a so-called "smart TV", it had an app that gave you access to a somewhat decent 3D video library to showcase what the TV could do. A mere few months after purchasing the TV, the app was removed through an update, and the only way the TV can now show any 3D content is by using whatever few 3D discs my dad had purchased.
Personally I still don't tell people to avoid Sony - that's my choice - but for my own purchases, I've boycotted them for decades for similar reasons.
For my own Windows systems - everything goes through a WSUS server, so any and all updates must be approved by myself first. As a result, I've never seen any of the nagware that people were complaining about when MS was pushing Windows 8 (and later 10) hard to get people to migrate away from Win7.
Updates are good. But you should always have the final say as to whether you want them or not.
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In my opinion Sony got off too lightly for their root kit. They should have been hit with a DCMA violation for every single DVD sold with this root kit as they damaged every single PC that had one of these DVDs inserted, even if the movie wasn't played.
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Agreed.
I still remember reading Russinovich's[^] blog posts about both Sony's and Symantec's rootkits. Interesting times.
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When one creates something which can be "fixed" that easily, one also admits that it will be buggy and will require such updates frequently. Updates to malware signature databases and similar are fine of course, but not updates to the software or Operating System.
At worst, it allows the developers to become lazy. And of course, if the software being updated is buggy, how can one expect the update module itself to be bug-free?
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Not at all. A long time ago in a house far, far away (the other side of town)...
At one time I used a popular CD authoring application that issued patches frequently. Yes, patches. The patches were cumulative and if one of them borked you had to uninstall the whole mess, clean up your disk and registry by hand, and start from scratch.
I finally gave up and spent the money on the 2nd-rated authoring application.
Software Zen: delete this;
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Quote: I finally gave up and spent the money on the 2nd-rated authoring application.
Was that out of necessity after the first software house was firebombed?
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I can neither confirm nor deny that speculation, besides I was not anywhere at the time.
Software Zen: delete this;
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Checking my email just now, I got a bogus "reply" to a "Quick Answers" question I did not ask.
The email looked exactly like a legitimate notice that a question had been answered.
Thankfully, I read it all before clicking the link and there was an offer to go to a porno site to see Russian girls, etc.
Has anyone else experienced something like this?
Not joking...
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Are you sure this is not the hamsters making extra money on the side? 
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Mind Bleach! I need Mind Bleach!
@Sean-Ewington in a mankini was bad enough, but ... 
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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That's likely phishing. Don't open stuff like that, it at least sends back an "Eddie Opened it" so it's the right bait return. So they'll cast again and again.
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From CP or ChEaPestPAiNPi11sATvirus-basket.biz.ru?
If the former, probably a spammer abusing the send an email feature here. 
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
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Probably a spammer actually sending from
Dan Neely wrote: ChEaPestPAiNPi11sATvirus-basket.biz.ru
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Slow Eddie wrote: I read it all before clicking the link and there was an offer to go to a porno site to see Russian girls, etc.
So then you clicked it even harder? 
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Sander Rossel wrote: harder
Poor choice of words Sander.
"It is easy to decipher extraterrestrial signals after deciphering Javascript and VB6 themselves.", ISanti[ ^]
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I feel the need to post something with “track ball” on this sub thread.
There! Got it out of my system.
Now I need a better word for “got”.
Dang it!
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englebart wrote: Now I need a better word for “got”.
englebart wrote: There! Got Purged it out of from my system.
Lending a helping hand.
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I haven't done any programming for about 5 years now. I opened stack overflow to get hands dirty again. None of the things make sense to me anymore. People are talking about so many new Async objects and words that are alien to me. I feel useless.
I am very bad with reading books and learning new things and I can only spare about couple hours a week outside of regular work on computers. This is problematic as I cannot simply pick up a book or start writing code. I lack imagination too as in what to write. My ideas are too old.
Have you been there and what made you restore your dignity in your mind? I will definitely try alcohol but was looking if there are alternatives.
"It is easy to decipher extraterrestrial signals after deciphering Javascript and VB6 themselves.", ISanti[ ^]
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dan!sh wrote: I will definitely try alcohol but was looking if there are alternatives.
Drugs?
"In testa che avete, Signor di Ceprano?"
-- Rigoletto
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dan!sh wrote: Have you been there
Yes, on specific topics, for instance 'app development for mobile phones', or 'machine learning', ...
Quote: what made you restore your dignity in your mind
Basically nothing.
"In testa che avete, Signor di Ceprano?"
-- Rigoletto
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